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morea
10-24-2005, 07:56 PM
I'm sorry Liam - but the first thing that jumps out at me is the shape of the ascender on the "h" - :o
wha' how? ?!?!?!
O.O
how you reply so quick?
ok, so at least we found one prob, bearning in mind its only about 5/10 mins work (just before i went to sleep last night) just had to start on it, wanna make this my best site ever.....
morea
10-24-2005, 08:01 PM
a) magic... ;)
b) it's not that there's anything wrong with it really... just looks a bit phallic to me.
John G
10-24-2005, 08:18 PM
is it art hockley, or hockley art? There really isn't a defined "read this first." In fact it looks like it should read right to left and then down, which is completely backwards for english and gives a bad tension or vibe to me straight off (if it reads left to right, then it reads from bottom to top and you have the same problem). And no copperplate for the font, it's like using arial for a logo, it works, but eh...?? There are just plenty of things to do to a font rather than using a well known one and keeping it rather stock. My thoughts (dig the colors of the logo, if the penis thing is your thing, go for it). ;)
Jeff Fisher LogoMotives
10-25-2005, 12:42 AM
it's not that there's anything wrong with it really... just looks a bit phallic to me.
And limp at that!
:o) - J.
im not sure about the orientation of the word Hockley. It seems to be too close to the penis, i mean h.
Vikia
10-25-2005, 02:12 AM
And limp at that!
:o) - J.
http://www.vikiandersonsites.com/forumimages/omg.gif
distruktor
10-25-2005, 07:53 AM
liam,
why are you trying to make your logo look like a wave and a hill? is it something to do with where you live? or do you only do paintings of hills that are by the sea?
tell us a bit more about what you do and then we'll be able to judge it with more conviction. I do agree with the others though... it's slightly phallic maybe leave the serifs on the h standard, less is more and all that jazz.
dis.
LeeIs
10-25-2005, 08:48 AM
I agree with John G here. I also found it a bit confusing on how to read this. I thought it was Hockley Art from the first glance but found it weird that the Hockley was somehow after the Art. I like your choice of colours and I think you could really develop this concept much further than it is now. 5/10 minutes spent on a logo as you've admitted isn't enough IMO, and it definately shows.
true, it was a "spur of the moment thing.
anyways, i was grounded from internet yesterday >.<
but that was crap, disregard it, i spend all day offline, yesterday working on a new portfolio site, (improved the logo too)
;)
ill post lata
John G
10-25-2005, 06:50 PM
I wouldn't disregard it totally, I think it definately has some potiential, whether or not that was how you want to portray yourself, well that's another matter.
ok, well, my new portfolio site, i used an "imporved version" of the logo.
www.curve.serveftp.com and the look i want is mountain/ocean
the reaosn being, from a young age i've allways seen that as the true beauty in nature, where as others may like snow or something hehe
nothing i like more than you sit on the beach looking in to the horizon w/ mountains around me, sooo relaxing :D
but i am very dissapointed at ome of the "feedback" on the logo, fiar enuff it was 5 mins work, but i diddnt need people immaturely saying it looks like a "penis" then joke about it, HOW THE **** WOULD YOU LIKE IT IF PEOPLE JOKE OVER YOUR WORK !?!?!
i know its only 5 minuites work, but say i hadnt told you that, and i had spend weeks on it???? only for you to turn it in to a joke. NOT VERY CONTRUSCTIVE IS IT???
anyways, im not even gonna bothter posting my site on here, for a critique,
curve.serveftp.com is the addy, but want none of your lame comments on it thx ;) as long as im proud of it, thats good enuff, bcuase i have seen some SHIT work on this showcase, that gets not even close to the harsh comments it deserves. so stfu plz.
ill lay low for a whille, (since i know you all be pissed at my comments)
PS: im sure some of you know that i speak my mind, whether you like it or not, sry if i offend anone ;)
that being said, there was a few good (constructive) comments. to them ppl ignore my comments. my comments are directed at those that like to joke about others work
I agree with John G here. I also found it a bit confusing on how to read this. I thought it was Hockley Art from the first glance but found it weird that the Hockley was somehow after the Art. I like your choice of colours and I think you could really develop this concept much further than it is now. 5/10 minutes spent on a logo as you've admitted isn't enough IMO, and it definately shows.
its meant to be read "Hockley (my last name) Art(what i do)" i dont see nothing wied about it, after all its a name and the work art is a line below so obvuisly it would be read after, trying to be CREATIVE w/ type here. but you read it fine, think you must have been thinking too hard :D
And limp at that!
:o) - J.
well if she diddnt stare too hard at the god dam monitor, you would realize that the shape is TRIANGULAR meaning its a TRIANGLE and possibley and ARROW?
just some advice, dont try to critique someones artwork, if you just got done watching a couple of hours of porn, cuz obvuisly it is damageing your perception ;)
morea
10-25-2005, 07:42 PM
wow, Liam. You're doing it again. The last time this happened you said you weren't going to post when you are "mad" because you don't like what someone says about your work. It would save you a lot of post editing later on.
You are over reacting. By the way, making personal attacks against people (whether you like what they say or not) is considered flaming... and as you know, it is against forum policy.
First of all, you're not very likely to "impress" a bunch of people who do this for a living with something you spent 5 minutes on.
Second, I bet you'd rather have someone point out to you that your "logo" might resemble something other than what you had intended BEFORE you go getting it printed up on stationery and posting it on your website.
Incidentally, I don't watch porn, (if your snide comment was intended for me) and I am also not the only person who had that impression. THAT makes it constructive feedback.
Maybe we need a separate area of the forum for all the under-18 members. :rolleyes:
Craig B
10-25-2005, 08:03 PM
but i diddnt need people immaturely saying it looks like a "penis" then joke about it
I thought Morea's initial comments about it appearing phallic were valid and not immature at all. The later comment about it appearing limp was clearly a joke by Jeff (note the smiley face) and I'm sure he meant nothing by it personally.
its meant to be read "Hockley (my last name) Art(what i do)" i dont see nothing wied about it, after all its a name and the work art is a line below so obvuisly it would be read after, trying to be CREATIVE w/ type here. but you read it fine, think you must have been thinking too hard
I also thought Lee and John's comments about readability were valid. I've know n a few people named Art and so perhaps your name was Art Hockley. It's hard to know. It's not a matter of thinking too hard, it was a valid question and a valid critique.
i know its only 5 minuites work, but say i hadnt told you that, and i had spend weeks on it????
The amount of time spent on the logo is irrelevant and has nothing to do with people's critiques. Even if you had spent weeks on it, the phallic resemblence and the readability still would have been valid. There are times when someone might work on a graphic, logo or mark for 5-10 minutes and you hit pay dirt right off the bat.
In general, if you're looking for feedback and critiques, be open-minded when listening to them. I honestly don't see a reason for your outburst against the criticism. Hostility and unwilligness to listen to feedback are not good qualities to have in our field.
TheBluePanda
10-25-2005, 08:11 PM
but i am very dissapointed at ome of the "feedback" on the logo, fiar enuff it was 5 mins work, but i diddnt need people immaturely saying it looks like a "penis" then joke about it, HOW THE **** WOULD YOU LIKE IT IF PEOPLE JOKE OVER YOUR WORK !?!?!
i know its only 5 minuites work, but say i hadnt told you that, and i had spend weeks on it???? only for you to turn it in to a joke. NOT VERY CONTRUSCTIVE IS IT???
Wow, you're psycho. Might want to work on your grammar while you're workin' on the phallic logo. :)
Satchel
10-25-2005, 08:15 PM
wow I thought this thread was going quite well - until this out break!
*shakes head*
I think you're onto something with that under 18 thing morea
Craig B
10-25-2005, 08:17 PM
That's what I thought as well Satchel. Prior to the outburst I thought all the criticism was positive and would help Lliam to look at other approaches.
screw this, you cant take a taste of your own medicine?
you start joking about my work looking liek a DICK regardless of how you word it...
comments NOT directed at morea it was directed at the guy that thinks its a JOKE
ffs, Graphic design is not a joke, i take it pretty dam serious, dunno about you guys....
anyways, im NOT under 18, i'm 19 ffs, and sry to say it, you made me go off on one, cuz i took that joke very personal and was completely inconsiderate to JOKE about it
the first criticism by morea was fair enuff, its when you take it to the next level, and trun it in to a "diss"
then for morea to just jump in thinknig my comments where directed at her alone???
ffs ... w/e
time for another few month break
this obvuisly aint gonna work
how can i GROW as a designer if poeple are joking ffs....
if i wnated jokes i would look elsewhere
c ya'z
Jimeda Fork
10-25-2005, 08:42 PM
. . .spur of the moment thing . . . anyways, i was grounded from internet yesterday
I'd like to say a few things here.
This is a free forum, no requirements to join, no subscription fee. etc. So you have to take the good with the bad.
After viewing what little information that is available in Liam's public profile, he is 18yrs old. 19 at most. We as members should keep in mind our audience before posting. If someone told me that my logo looked like a penis. I would be grateful for their opinion. I wouldn't want a logo like that.
My advise to Liam, if you are really interested in the graphic arts field. Go to art school and get everything you can out of it.
One of the best things in art school is a wall critique. It's where you put your work on the wall and EVERYONE critiques it. This is an excellent tool to help you take suggestions/constructive criticism. It also helps you ignore the random shots people make about your work. Challenge these criticisms and ask the offender to explain.
ie. If you ask me what I think about you logo, and I respond, "it sucks" you then ask me why do I think it sucks? If I can't explain it. Ignore me because if I can't give you an explanation, I'm not worth getting upset over.
And just for kicks, I vote this for the quote of the week, "anyways, i was grounded from internet yesterday"
Edit: Liam posted while I was typing.
Dude - you're wacko. and this is a forum not IM chat so spell out your words.
Wait, what was that? Was that your mommy yelling at you for playing on the computer again? Better get your homework done sonny.
John G
10-25-2005, 08:45 PM
In my experience, critiquing should not be warm fuzzy time Liam. Saying warm fuzzies doesn't do a damn bit of good in making you a better designer (well sometimes it does). Personally I think you have two choices on the subject of "negative" critiquing (which are really the better comments to get for improving yourself) get used to it or get out. Not everything you make is going to smell like roses and not everybody is going to be nice (you don't want just nice comments either).
The penis stuff and other weird things DO in fact show up, people DO form associations, if a designer sees it, other people will see it. We aren't "special" when we (designers) look at things, other people see these things too.
Critiquing isn't a right or wrong thing but a "hey, I see this when I look at it, it might look/work better when you do this." Nothing is set in stone, it's another's view of your work from a different perspective, perhaps one that you didn't see before (to take or shun at your will).
Craig B
10-25-2005, 09:22 PM
I'm not sure how else to respond. I think even after the outburst we pretty much all calmly explained to Liam how critiquing worked. Critiquing is not, "Let me show you my work so that you can all pat me on the back and say, 'nice job!'"
You put it out there for people to critique it good or bad. If you think someone's critique is unfounded or off base, ignore it. However in the case of the phallic reference, I don't think it was off base. If you view that as joking or as insulting, then you have a lot of growing to do.
The wall critique that Jimeda described would be just the thing for you Liam. Go to school and give it a shot. Tone down on the "everyone's out to get me" mentality and listen.
morea
10-25-2005, 09:50 PM
screw this, you cant take a taste of your own medicine?
Liam, that's not what this board is about. Please review the GDF Code of Conduct (http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7787) and our Netiquette Guidelines (http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7786).
Also, this thread (http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3402) contains an article on how to give and receive criticiques - and while it can be difficult to hear criticism of your work without taking it personally, but that's something that everyone in this field has to learn if they want to stick with it.
comments NOT directed at morea it was directed at the guy that thinks its a JOKE
You might want to take Jeff's advice seriously, to be honest. Logo Design is what he does for a living... and he is quite good at it. ;)
As Craig said, don't take it personally.
Mynock
10-25-2005, 09:53 PM
If it means anything, I watch porn on regular basis and I didn't see a penis until someone pointed it out. And I still think you need to stretch to make that connection. Don't quit because of what we said, jeez. Take some heart from 13yrGuru and keep truckin' no matter what we do to your threads.
If I remember correctly Liam is in design school.
You need to relax Liam, they were just trying to help by pointing out some things that you did not see. Rejection and criticism are a huge part of this business, if you can't take a little internet crit without blowing up what are you going to when you are face to face with a client? You will not sell many $25 logos if you tell off all your clients because that wanted to make changes. Almost every one of your clients will make changes, and some of them will HATE it and send you to start from scratch. Shit happens. GDF is a great resource and your immature behavior as you see above really puts a lot of people off. You will learn very quickly not to burn bridges in this industry.
If you really want a harsh crit post your "penis" logo on the HOW forum, and post the link here - I could use a good laugh.
If it means anything, I watch porn on regular basis and I didn't see a penis until someone pointed it out.
Now we know what Mynock does on his lunch break... ;)
danedawg99
10-25-2005, 10:44 PM
If you really want a harsh crit post your "penis" logo on the HOW forum, and post the link here - I could use a good laugh.
that's no crap. I posted my resume there and was literally told "holy craptacular, batman...re-do it" That was after it had gotten passing marks here. Liam, I don't honestly think you're near ready to be doing this kind of work. You need to build a MUCH thicker skin if you're wanting to make it in this (or any creative) field. That said, I think this logo showed promise. Change the font on the h and that gets rid of the phallic-ness. I'd keep workin' this one. It might grow into an unqualified success. then, it might not. Who can tell? ;)
morea
10-25-2005, 11:04 PM
You will not sell many $25 logos if you tell off all your clients because that wanted to make changes.
oh good Lord, another one. :rolleyes:
I was thinking Pedo Gonzalez might have to dust off his e-mail account :p
Liam, you might have to lighten up mate. I'm sure i've had threads where people make stupid comments about my work, take it on the chin. Its not the end of the world. Most of the comments people make are not meant to be malicious, usually if you are genuinely seeking feedback and putting effort into your work people will appreciate it. Somtimes we just get carried away, just stick with it.
casedsgn
10-26-2005, 03:43 AM
Wow, this is crazy. I don't know that I've ever seen anyone take a crit so poorly. Whether there was a little joking going on or not, the comments and suggestions made were all valid. I read it as "Art Hockley" and immediatley felt the logo was phallic.
Is this a common reaction from the younger members here? If so, maybe we really do need to create a "tread lightly" section for those who want to hear what other people think... if it's possitive...??
well, i was fine when morea said all taht needed to be siad.
its when soemone was like,
YA THAT LOOKS LIEKE A DICK,
then someone else says
YA A LIMP ONE TOO.
dont you aggree, that is taking things a lil too far?
im a smart man (if i do say so myslef) and i only need to be told something ONCE to make a note, for the record i DID redo the logo, despite the dick jokes. and i think i fixed it. but tbh, as a lot of you know, i have anger management probs and only take a TRIGGER to set me off, morea got the critique fine, i could have taken her advice and fixed the problem, but before i have a chance, i got jerks pointing and laughing at the original concept that i was gonna fix from the advice i ALLREADY GOT!!!
as i allready siad, i can lighten up, but not in this circumstances, i need seriousness, and dont need jokes/makeing fun of, and shit, thats just unfiar, and NOT constructice.
take this hypethetical situation:
YOU design a logo, soemone reviews it, tells you whats wrong, and how to fix, then someone else comes a long and is like HAHAHAHAHA!!!!HAHAHAH!!!ROFL!!!!LOL!!!THATS POO!!!!
when you was all ready to fix the logo using your previous advice, would not the laughing bother you?!?!? well it did me, and sorry i took it so personal. and i was all intending to "fix" the logo, i think i clearly explained that.
and one last thing, QUIT TALKING SHIT ON THE FACT IM SLIGHTLY DYSLEXIC FFS!!!!
Dude - you're wacko. and this is a forum not IM chat so spell out your words.
Wait, what was that? Was that your mommy yelling at you for playing on the computer again? Better get your homework done sonny.
3 word "YOUR A *****" fyi, i have my OWN pc, and getting my OWN apartment, and have my OWN responsibilites, so STFU, you stupid *******, and ya, im slightly dyslexic, you got a frikken problem w/ that???
you make me SICK..... pfffft.....
PS: you dont know me ;)
casedsgn
10-26-2005, 04:21 AM
Dude.. calm down bro. We've all had plenty people laugh at us or our work during a critique. Brush it off... laugh a little. Learn to roll with the punches.
Wow, this is crazy. I don't know that I've ever seen anyone take a crit so poorly. Whether there was a little joking going on or not, the comments and suggestions made were all valid. I read it as "Art Hockley" and immediatley felt the logo was phallic.
Is this a common reaction from the younger members here? If so, maybe we really do need to create a "tread lightly" section for those who want to hear what other people think... if it's possitive...??
sry case *looks ashamed*
your one designer i look up to a lot.
trust me my outburst was triggered only by the fact that my work was JOKED about, im hapy to work on stuff, but hate it when ppl point and laugh, its a big blow to the confidence, and prolly the extreem oposite to contructive imo.
i aggreed w/ all the techical stuff, and aggreed the ARROW looked "crooked" maybye not phaylic, just a crooked triangle?
but for soemone to take a critique that is give to ME and then turn it in to a joke, is when i flipped, sry guys,
PS: you cant tell me you are not used to it, and i WANT you to tear my designs apart, thats why i post here, but NOT joke. this isnt a game, sorry to say :(
Dude.. calm down bro. We've all had plenty people laugh at us or our work during a critique. Brush it off... laugh a little. Learn to roll with the punches.
you rox man, ;)
i think this post should be:
A) hijacked in to a FUN topic, (non-phaylic)
B) closed
C) pruned of anything phaylic
just ANYTHING to change the topic, as that logo is now old anyways hehe.
im cheering up, guess it WAS a joke wasnt, it?, hehe oh well.
I REEEEEELY WANNA TAKE UP MARTIAL ARTS AGAIN FOR ANGER MANGEMENT :D
edit: oh btw, did i tell you about my new site? (link is sig) forget what i said earlier, tell me what you think, and joke about it if you want too, bet you cant find anything "phalic" about it.
i also learnt a new work, didnt know what phalic meant til, earlier, when i had to look it up, you learn something everyday i guess, hehe
think what i need is "conditioning" maybye ill go to the how forums, for some HARD criticism, so it will make me a stronger crtique taker :)
lol
hmmm, site has been up all day and im yet to sell a $25 logo, lmao
dam i suxor :)
(i love l33t talk, so cute, hehe)
that's no crap. I posted my resume there and was literally told "holy craptacular, batman...re-do it" That was after it had gotten passing marks here.
http://www.howdesign.com/forum/messages.asp?topicID=349888&page=last
thats where i posted my new website >.<
who knows how they gonna tear it apart lmao
posted a link, i know they not reviewing the "penis" but i did as was asked, hehe. posted some of my work, lmao
distruktor
10-26-2005, 08:18 AM
Liam,
its seems like you have relaxed now which is good, i am now aware that you have anger managment issues and am sorry if anything i said 'triggered' you... however your logo did look slightly rude as a lot of people agreed so i am not going to appologise for saying that... because it did.
Im not sure what design studios are like where all you guys live but over this side of the pond you have to be thick skinned! Office banter is a big part of the working environment in England, in my 11 years of experience every creative deparment ive worked in has been a fun and inspiring place to work but people have a laugh and take the piss, fact... its not meant maliciously (hope i spelt that right) infact i personally enjoy it! it lightens up the mood and makes the day more light hearted.
What was said about your logo was not meant as a personal attack, at first it was a serious crit and then it was followed by a bit of light hearted fun... thats it
If you are going to perssue a career in this industry then you have got to learn to roll with the punches and have a laugh...
trust me, if you strike up a good freindship with the people you work with its not like going to work, its like hanging out with another set of freinds and doing something you all love, designing.
dis.
ya, i hear ya, louad and clear, would be way different is someoen jokingly siad it in person tho' i have a great sense of humor, but i like to be serious at times, hehe
and as for the anger management, i try toi apologize for when i "freak out" but tbhb, it cant really be helped, >.<
but if you know me good, you will know i love to have a laugh, and stuff :D
also got a lot of stress atm, for some of the following reasons:
1. just found out im not geting financial aid for college, after waiting all summer for the paperwork to come back
2. working very bad job atm, earning only $100 per week
3. want to get out of Nebraska asap, cuz i HATE this place
4. VERY crucial time in my life as far as college choice ect, and panicing a LOT cuz I need that piece of shit paperwork (degree) for my "dream" career
5. getting very scared lately, cuz I am worrying that its getting "too late" 19 atm
6. want nothing more than a graphic design job, and to get out of the boring midwest (also bad market for design)
so basicly im working part time, and online abou 10+ hours per day, and tbh at this point i dont care about taking out a HUGE loan to pay for college. Cuz there is nothing else i could see myself doing other than design, and believe that i can make it, just very stressed that my college has been put on hold, then again it could be a blessing, since i am not gonna get grants, i HAVE to take out loan, and so im looking for specialist art schools. Im sure ill be better when i get a better part time job, cuz right now im being ripped off, 6.60 for working my ass off at local deli....
distruktor
10-26-2005, 10:52 AM
5. getting very scared lately, cuz I am worrying that its getting "too late" 19 atm
ha ha ha...dude i wish i was 19 again!!! don't worry, at youre age youve got plenty of time ahead of you, youre only just starting out
dis
ya, i think im panicking for nothing here >.<
need to get back in college asap,
the fafsa is shittin me so that hardly keeps my confidence up , they expect my parents to pay the entire cost of college >.<
bebestix
10-26-2005, 11:23 AM
yeah, still a long way to go :P
Jimeda Fork
10-26-2005, 01:09 PM
3 word "YOUR A *****" fyi, i have my OWN pc, and getting my OWN apartment, and have my OWN responsibilites, so STFU, you stupid *******, and ya, im slightly dyslexic, you got a frikken problem w/ that???
you make me SICK..... pfffft.....
PS: you dont know me ;)
Ok, I know what I posted above was harsh. And I apologize for going to far. This is a public forum and that is how you reacted. You are right. I don't know you. And from what I've seen on this thread alone, I don't want to.
And I wasn't "bashing" you on your spelling. I simply stated what has been discussed over and over. The majority of people on this forum want to read words not IM speak.
From the "New User FAQ" posted by Kool:
9. Try to use proper English. Posts full of poor spelling, no punctuation, grammar, and constant "chatspeak" (ie: "U" for "you", "4" for "for", etc) make a post very difficult to read. An occasional 'LOL', or 'OMG' is ok as long as it doesn't get out of hand. Regular posters do not want to have to decipher every post that comes their way.
Look, I have no agenda with you. I think you overreacted to some criticism you didn't appreciate it. But heres the cold hard truth to this place. If you ask for opinions you're going to have to take the good with the bad. Otherwise your posting should read "new personal logo - good feedback only"
Can't say as I've ever been called an asterick before, but hey I have no hard feelings about it. I hope feel the same.
G-Man79
10-26-2005, 01:14 PM
Wow, you're psycho. Might want to work on your grammar while you're workin' on the phallic logo. :)
QOTW material for sure! Friggin hillarious TBP!
morea
10-26-2005, 01:25 PM
Is this a common reaction from the younger members here?
Case - it is sadly QUITE common for some of our younger members to post a logo that they spent 5 minutes on along with a link to their website where they are offering to sell "professional" logos for $5 - $25.
Most of the time, these people don't want a legitimate critique, they want everybody to tell them that they did a good job and move on.
Liam, you need to learn to act like an adult here. Take the time to spell your words out... "leet" talk is not cute, it's juvenile. That's why I suggested that you read over the forum netiquette rules, some of which jimeda fork posted above. Spell check your posts if you have to instead of just typing out a rant and clicking "submit" - and ditch the attitude to the other members.
STOP swearing and calling names. If you can't treat other members with respect, you will not be welcome here.
Liam, we've been down this road before my friend. Go back and read what I told you the last time you threw one of these tantrums. If you can't control yourself don't post in the showcase anymore.
ooooooooook, i try lighten the mood and you turn out the lights.
nice one....
whos the "jevenile" here
c ya ;)
Jimeda Fork
10-26-2005, 07:27 PM
As my momma says: Some are slow to learn, some never learn.
You figure out which one you are.
Liam, there has been good advise posted in this thread if you care to find it.
As far as "c ya," I think that's twice in this thread that you've threatened to leave. If you're gonna go. Then go.
Drorain
10-26-2005, 07:34 PM
liam saw your comments on HOW, let me just say...be prepared to get flamed their...we're kind on GDF...maybe even soft, but the people on the how forums are going to utterly flip out to your reasoning on price...and the concept.
I'm not flaming you, just forwarning youof how abrassive they are over there
Yeah, if you don't like us just head over to HOW. They just love guys like you. :D
casedsgn
10-26-2005, 07:45 PM
Wow, yeah... I checked out the HOW post as well. Liam, you may just want to stop looking at that thread. Save yourself some potential anger and just unsubscribe from it. People have made comments on your logo, on your type choice, on your layout, etc. and not only have you ignored them, you've retaliated with shots and put-downs... just like here. Best to leave well enough alone and move on to something else man.
Drorain
10-26-2005, 07:45 PM
liam just curious about the design program your working thru in school right now, your a first year student right?
I didnt touch the computer until my 2nd year, first year was all foundation classes. Now just a suggestion, take it or leave it...maybe you want to work on your production skills for now, and wait on design until you learn it more indepth.
Learning the programs by executing drawings, color correction, vectorization of photos might be a better tool than trying to fly full force into design. Even with a degree in graphic design, a production artist is likely to be your first job anyway, try and get some of that practice done now
reuber1
10-26-2005, 07:48 PM
Not to go off topic, though I think that already happened three pages ago, but I'm actually glad I started reading through this. I can see how I can get when I get upset (although I really hope I'm not that bad). I know I've had my differences with a few members a while ago, but man I hope I wasn't like that to anyone. I thought the critiques were rather constructive, and honestly I would rather hear up front if my logo resembles something totally different, even if it is a little embarassing; think if we didn't say anything and you had printed it all out.
Oh well, I guess a little observing ego goes a long way. I'll be cheery from now on! :D
An old Cherokee was teaching his grandchildren about life. He said to them,
"A battle is raging inside me ... it is a terrible fight between two wolves.
One wolf represents fear, anger, envy, sorrow, regret, greed, arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority, lies, false pride, superiority and ego.
The other stands for joy, peace, love, hope, sharing, serenity, humility, kindness, benevolence, friendship, empathy, generosity, truth, compassion and faith."
The old man fixed the children with a firm stare. "This same fight is going on inside you, and inside every other person, too."
They thought about it for a minute and then one child asked his grandfather, "Which wolf will win?"
The old Cherokee replied: "The one you feed."
Drorain
10-26-2005, 09:21 PM
thats a nice allegory MD
just got a constructive critique from HOW, more than i can say for this lame ass thread,
as i said, lock the thread or whatever, so i can leave, not knowign that you talkin shit behind my back
oh f* it, someone frikken bann me or something
this isnt doing me ONE bit of good.
just one last thing i wanna say please read it and remember plz:
"you guys used to be mentors to me, guided me, and pointed me in the right direction. I then get busy and of course still working on graphic design. I remember saying that i would look back on this and thank all you guys if i ever became successful. What i now come to realize is that you think you are "superior" and basicly jerks becuase you dont wanna constuctively critique my work. please take note of the guy on HOW forum, that outlined his points and THEN explained how to fix it, ya it wasnt a good critique, but he wasnt joking and becuase of that i respect what he siad, as being inteligent and therefor of worth to me to take not of. I guess the time here is up, I respect all of you and wish you all the best in the future, but this resource has been exausted for me (either that, or the fact that you have changed (for the worse)
i allwyas looked up to: case , bigperm (dont see him anymore) cuz they where two designers that gave me advice right at the start of my using this forum. they where allways positive in thier encouragement, and very constriuctive) anyways, tihs is it,
im asking very politely that someone either ban me or delete my account.
farewell, i'll now continue my "journey" trying to grow as designer."
/liam
Drorain
10-26-2005, 09:32 PM
thats right cause...I dont know...I came out of college only 2 years ago, I'm so out of touch, damn man thank you for pointing that out
I tried to point you on another path until you learn design, the aspects of design, contrast, shape, type, imagery, all that...but as you know everything you are set to go off in the world young padawan.
Satchel
10-26-2005, 09:40 PM
why do you need to get banned? just dont come back!
This isn't a life or death situation - someones a drama queen!
reuber1
10-26-2005, 09:46 PM
You know what I haven't had in a while?
morea
10-26-2005, 09:47 PM
ooh, what?
Drorain
10-26-2005, 09:48 PM
why do you need to get banned? just dont come back!
This isn't a life or death situation - someones a drama queen!
as you can see liams got some history with us...joined in june 04, I think he was around a little before then on the old forum as well, but anyway...he has presented to us about 3-6 identities over the last 1-2 years. We give him some constructive crits but he always reacts very...emotionally. To be blunt he flies off the handle. Now I been where he is now, but worse I questioned my design ability in my last 2 years of school because of teachers that were worse than we are on the board.
I was even told to consider another career or to study an extra year. I was hot-headed and stubborn tho, This was a good thing, I had my best teacher tell me I would do very well so I gave the bird to the program director and pushed on. I did end up graduating a year late simply because I put off my internship, I didnt take additional classes, I worked full time in a grocery store. I was glad the teacher was so hard on me though, she was absolutely right, I am doing fine career wise now, but I'd be better if I listened to her, applied myself better, and worked my 2 jobs less.
I like liam, I think he has potential, but fly off the handle like that in a portfolio review you may see yourself dismissed. Like I said earlier work on production skills for now, worry about design as you actually learn it.
Drorain
10-26-2005, 09:49 PM
You know what I haven't had in a while?
a little wine and cheese reuber?
reuber1
10-26-2005, 09:49 PM
Big League Chew
Drorain
10-26-2005, 09:51 PM
oh I was close
John G
10-26-2005, 09:52 PM
(in reference to Liam's posts)
wow. That's all I can say, wow.
reuber1
10-26-2005, 09:53 PM
A little Family Guy reference now and then is appropriate. :D
I almost went w/ the wine and cheese.
How was theirs more constructive than ours?
Jimeda Fork
10-26-2005, 09:54 PM
Positive comments from the HOW forum:
"Then do them for free...no use charging a client if you suck."
Drorain
10-26-2005, 09:55 PM
one person out of many howies actually took the time to offer a point by point breakdown of the site...with a little instruction...He should be glad the How forum was pretty quiet today
reuber1
10-26-2005, 09:56 PM
HOW forum
" Anyways there is nothing good about this site, the type is bad, there is no concept to the site, you just threw a couple lines in there with some bad type.
Your logo, needs work also what is it supposed to say about you, what is it supposed to describe about you? The colors could use alot of work.
Looks lke you went right to the computer with everything here, did no brainstorming, and had no concepts before you started.
And one of the worst parts your advertising designing logos for 25 bucks. What the hell is that about? "
ya it wasnt a good critique
My personal favorite line of that rant.
Don't ask for a crit from professionals if you are going to brush all of their advice off as garbage. This guy took time out of his day (like many here on GDF) to help you out and you had the arrogance to flame him. Thats pretty classless, I think you need a reality check.
Anyways there is nothing good about this site, the type is bad, there is no concept to the site, you just threw a couple lines in there with some bad type.
Your logo, needs work also what is it supposed to say about you, what is it supposed to describe about you? The colors could use alot of work.
Looks lke you went right to the computer with everything here, did no brainstorming, and had no concepts before you started.
Maybe you should listen to cKy, It may not be the nicest post but it is honest.
Craig B
10-26-2005, 10:08 PM
Even with all of the rage-filled responses by Liam, we've still all done a pretty good job of maintianing our professionalism and trying to point out how to better handle people's critiques.
He was so angry over essentially the penis comment that he absolutely ignored all of the other positive and helpful critiques (in fact, the comment about the ascender of the "h" appearing phallic was also a helpful critique.)
Anger management is defintiely an issue to work on.
uncle carbunkle
10-26-2005, 10:10 PM
so many dicks, so much apathy...
...bah. good luck with that.
Jimeda Fork
10-26-2005, 10:14 PM
Another thought just came to me.
Liam is 19 and in or headed to college. He has the opportunity to create a network of associates here. I don't think that he's using it to the fullest potential. Potential employers can/do view this site looking for designers. Don't burn your bridges before you have a chance to finish building them. This place is a great resource for employment opportunities. Just ask GreenThumb.
Neuro
10-26-2005, 10:36 PM
Very good point Jimeda Fork!! It's easy to get raging about someone's comment but lashing out is not the PROFESSIONAL way to handle it. My personal opinion is cool the jets a bit Liam. Then come back and you'll see that there is a lot more to offer here. Also be respectful of your fellow GDF members. Check out their stuff and you will realize that many of them are very successful. These are the types that you want to have in your corner. They are willing to take time our of their busy schedules to mentor "up and comers." Be respectful!!
Also if we see it, your clients will see it!
GreenThumb
10-26-2005, 11:42 PM
Hey Liam,
You posted on HOW...I was surprised that the wolves left you alone..the critiques dished out there were pale in comparison to what other people normally get.
You should treasure this forum a LOT more....people here are a lot nicer and take the time to articulate their dislike; a courtesy that won't be extended to you on HOW and the real world.
Send me a PM, and Ill give you my email and contact info....well talk and Ill fill you in on the big, bad world of advertising and design.
PS: If you are looking for a graphic design college in Nebraska, goto Kearney-hands down.
jlknauff
10-27-2005, 12:38 AM
I'm sorry Liam - but the first thing that jumps out at me is the shape of the ascender on the "h" - :oLOL, didn't notice till you mentioned it.
Jimeda Fork
10-27-2005, 02:02 AM
Neither did the person who designed this. Now just imagine if he/she would have asked us for feedback.
morea
10-27-2005, 02:05 AM
yeah... I didn't even NOTICE the bosoms at first! :o
jlknauff
10-27-2005, 02:10 AM
have to think that was on purpose...sort of to generate buzz
Jimeda Fork
10-27-2005, 02:10 AM
But I noticed yours . . .
Jimeda Fork
10-27-2005, 02:13 AM
have to think that was on purpose...sort of to generate buzz
not sure of generating a buzz but maybe getting a rise out of people?
reuber1
10-27-2005, 02:27 AM
I'm sure it got a rise out of many of those with a Y chromosome.
GreenThumb
10-27-2005, 04:36 AM
People,
Liam has something to say..... :)
Go on Liam...
would like to apologize for anyone that i may have offendded when i "flew off"
sincere apology you can either take or leave.
i "lost my cool" and that as you know happens, and i am not one bit proud of it.
morea- if you took any of the comments i said to heart, please forgive me, in fact non of them where even intended towards you. since you worded things as descreet as possible.
that being siad, freaking out like i did is not RIGHT and this is yet again, another post of the many that i will regret....
is my fault in the begining for being stupid and posting something that was not "critique worthy".
i was offended by a lot of the comments made, so much that i didnt stop to realize what i was actually saying back...
i ask that you forget about what i said, and hope that we can move on.
i will post (of course not yet)
and will have to try and make sure i dont explode again, im practicing on the HOW forum, to get me used to "harsh" feedback, so i can build a tougher skin.
i by no means want "easy" critiquing in future, cuz that does me no good, i just need to learn to take it for waht its worth (help) and not take so personal.
i made a mistake, i hope i can be forgiven.
>.<
/liam
good onya mate, thats the way. Next time take 10 deep breaths... then punch the nearest wall. :)
Liam has something to say..... :)
Go on Liam...
I just have visions of when i was little and i went skitz at my parents, then my grandad went and fetched me out of my room. (no offence Liam) ;)
morea
10-27-2005, 12:40 PM
Good man, Liam.
It's something we've all had to go through, and you will get used to it in time. Some of the most important things I had to learn in life were how to laugh at myself, and how to realize that criticism of my work was not the same as criticism of *me*.
You have a passion for what you do, and that can take you far... I think that you're on the right track. You'll get there. Once you learn to boil crits down into what people are really saying, your work can improve dramatically.
I'm sure there are no hard feelings. ;)