Haven't we met before?

[joanna]

i am researching others views on the topic of the following question...

to what extent is graphic design being prevented from being original by referencing the already familiar?


notes to think about...

are the versions we have seen before that we are being faced with today devoid of the substance they held originally? is collage a primary example of just referencing other design? does it bring old concepts with it or encourage new ones or has it just become surface design? when were design styles first thought original and does graphic masochism fall into the same bracket of concern? is graphic design becoming design about design and what relationship does this create between the design and the designer?

happy debating...i look forward to your views!

[Broacher]

Aw, not this topic again.

[PrintDriver]

Sounds like a research paper to me.
Someone you know Broacher?

[jimking]

That's what it sounds like.

[Jeizzavelle]

I smell an essay question.

[jimking]

Could it be charlie again? http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16137

[captain spanky]

lol... how to drink/party/sleep all week and still get your essay modules in on time... get other people on the internet to write 'em! ;) :D

lol j/k

answers: Some, yes, yes, dunno, dunno, possibly and .... 'a sexy one!' - Zap Brannigan. :)

[captain spanky]

http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16137


LMAO!!!!! ^^^^ funny as!!! :D

[morea]

the IP is different, for what it's worth ;)

[tZ]

Actaully a quite easy question if you think about it.

I don't really want to do your homw work as I have enough of my own but, I'll share my logic this once,lol.

to what extent is graphic design being prevented from being original by referencing the already familiar?

The most obvious answer is graphic design is being prevented from being origional through… design.

All these elements and princibles and thoeries- why? Why must we communicate something? Why must we arrange things in regards to the "rules"?

Obviosly the easiest answer to my above questions is off course- the need for a universal langauge. Idf everyone created things that in no way corresponded through the "rules" outlined in design then design wouldn't be- so people would be origional- no?

However, if that was so to happen people stop using those formal ideas to influnce a active arrangment then the "arrangment" may not communicate at all- correct? Since, design revolves around what best communicates visually to an audience. For instance, if I were to design work without any active hierachy then that could said to "origional- correct? However, being on this forum as long as I have I have seen much of this type of design and normally it isn't sucssfull since, it doesn't follow design "standards"- what best communicates. However, it is "origional"… I quess.

So where I am getting at is yes we are most likly some what weighted down my basic fundemntal rules of design. Howevever, is it more important that your work look "origonal" or communicate to its audience? If the goal is for it to look origional then by all means break all the rules you like however, if your designing for an audience then the best way is to use design- since, that is what best communicates visually.

Also, this brings up one more idea- what is origional? I mean… that is a highly subjective thought pattern and can no way it be defined. The only way I can think of graphic design being "origional" is to break rules in order to enhance a communication. However, other then that… I can't really think of a way that can be defined.

ending… why fix it if it isn't broke?

As for collage… collage is design. There are opportunitied to break rules and what not but, you need to know what they are before they can be broken. So if your goal in life is to have "origional" work over well designed then go for it. However, clients and the people who - you know PAY pay in order to communiate and if by being origional you design lacks communication then… good luck.

This is basically a art vs. design topic when I think about it and yeah… thats that,lol.

[joanna]

ha ha!
im highly insulted to find that you all think im some kind of cheat!!! il have you know im in my third year of a degree course and im one of those girls who stays in and gets her work done...because she wants to not because she has to...i chose my degree for good reason and this is merely some collective initial research for a question i compiled myself-NOT that has been given to me to complete! im not a mark chaser, im an interested under grad and i apreciate the reply where ive actually been given some insightful thoughts (not answers!!!)-i can debate those myself seeing as none of you have realised its a debtae not a matter of right or wrong!
il leave it up there incase anyone fancies an INTELLIGENT conversation!
ta!

[joanna]

ha ha!
im highly insulted to find that you all think im some kind of cheat!!! il have you know im in my third year of a degree course and im one of those girls who stays in and gets her work done...because she wants to not because she has to...i chose my degree for good reason and this is merely some collective initial research for a question i compiled myself-NOT that has been given to me to complete! im not a mark chaser, im an interested under grad and i apreciate the reply where ive actually been given some insightful thoughts (not answers!!!)-i can debate those myself seeing as none of you have realised its a debtae not a matter of right or wrong!
il leave it up there incase anyone fancies an INTELLIGENT conversation!
ta! :rolleyes:

[morea]

well, check out that other thread. We get a lot of that here, so you can understand that people might be a little suspicious.

No sense getting offended. You barely know us. Usually people have to know us for MUCH longer before we offend them. ;)

[Mynock]

ha ha!
im highly insulted to find that you all think im some kind of cheat!!! il have you know im in my third year of a degree course and im one of those girls who stays in and gets her work done...because she wants to not because she has to...i chose my degree for good reason and this is merely some collective initial research for a question i compiled myself-NOT that has been given to me to complete! im not a mark chaser, im an interested under grad and i apreciate the reply where ive actually been given some insightful thoughts (not answers!!!)-i can debate those myself seeing as none of you have realised its a debtae not a matter of right or wrong!
il leave it up there incase anyone fancies an INTELLIGENT conversation!
ta!Does English come in your fourth year? I kid, I kid.
I don't get this one:
is graphic design becoming design about design and what relationship does this create between the design and the designer?Wha? I don't get what you are trying to ask I don't think you are too clear there. I think you might have too many "design"s in there.

[Kool]

Joanna's so insulted that she posted it twice! :)

[joanna]

lol! you guys sure know how to welcome someone new in!

in response to the 'design about design':
take a piece of design that references another style (eg it has hollywood themes and feelings (let your mind picture whatever you think fits there)) the designer is not so bothered about hollywood as an image but agrees its successful. their piece is therefore a parody and also a tribute to the look. irony and distance, are so much a part of postmodern design, that we overlook the fact its design about design but isnt it also design about power? and particularly the designers relationship with it...and with his or herself?

[reuber1]

i am researching others views on the topic of the following question...

to what extent is graphic design being prevented from being original by referencing the already familiar?

notes to think about...

are the versions we have seen before that we are being faced with today devoid of the substance they held originally? is collage a primary example of just referencing other design? does it bring old concepts with it or encourage new ones or has it just become surface design? when were design styles first thought original and does graphic masochism fall into the same bracket of concern? is graphic design becoming design about design and what relationship does this create between the design and the designer?
WTF is "graphic masochism?" Stabbing your eyes out with an exacto-knife, or using Publisher?

[reuber1]

I think if you are referencing past designs, it should be noted as to how it's being "referenced." Are you drawing inspiration from it, or just flat out copying? The former, I say you're still pretty original, but when you're simply the metaphysical Xerox of the reference piece, then that is clearly unoriginal.

TZ brings up a good point as well. You can easily be original in design, but what the hell would your piece look like? The client pays for what they want, and you can guide them and educate them as to what communicates the best, and that is typically what they want. Most clients don't really care if what you made is revolutionary design, so long as it makes them look good.

Then we go back to the old "is design art" debate. Sometime design is the "client's" art, unfortunately. :p

[reuber1]

Could it be charlie again? http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16137
Charlie was a dick.

[Kool]

You're right Joanna, Welcome to the forum. http://home.comcast.net/~rnick9/koolsmiley.gif

Looking at all these tiara avatars did you really expect intellengent debate from us LOL. Not to mention the rabit with a pancake on it head.

[Mynock]

It's pancake tiara thank you very much!!!

[EC]

It's pancake tiara thank you very much!!!

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/24.gif

[morea]

it needs some jewels Mynock.

[morea]

to what extent is graphic design being prevented from being original by referencing the already familiar?

it's hard to say, since we are practically drowned in advertising everywhere we go. Even subconsciously, that stuff sticks in your mind.

I try to start conceptualizing without looking at similar projects if possible, in order to avoid being influenced by other work.

It's awfully hard to think of something that no one else has ever thought of before, but it's possible to some extent. I don't ever sit down and say "huh, clients like swooshes, so this logo should contain a swoosh".

Does that help at all or am I just rambling again?

[Broacher]

>>Usually people have to know us for MUCH longer before we offend them<<

I feel so special. I was deeply offended on my very first visit.

It's a good thing I have lots of dogs to kick.

[morea]

it was me, wasn't it Broacher. Sorry about that. ;)

[PrintDriver]

Isn't it "pancaking tiara"?
And every pancake requires some 'jewels' present...No?

Broacher, we offended you? Yet you keep coming back? Do I detect a masochistic streak there?

[joanna]

yeah that makes sense Morea. maybe its something to do with when references to the past are made, they are being realised with new improvements (if we are talking about design in the wider sense)?
maybe society would reject a new/radical approach-lets face it, dont we all like to stick to what we know!?

[joanna]

>>"I try to start conceptualizing without looking at similar projects if possible, in order to avoid being influenced by other work"<<

i like that way of working you've suggested there, thats a nice thought and approach.
but then again, ive read a few interesting articles about subconcious memory triggers etc-we cant help sourcing from what we already know.
concepts are strange things-they have to arrive from an instant already experienced by ones self? but perhaps to make it more original, these concepts need to operate on a more personal level?

[PrintDriver]

Burn your computer. The computer and the programs used are agents for creating design that all looks the same.

There is a serious 1/2-bell curve shaped chart when describing design where the majority of users just screwing around to designers that all turn out stuff that looks basically the same because of the software make up the greater part of the curve. There are very few designers in the flange of the 1/2-bell that transcend their software these days.

[Broacher]

The most offensive discovery for me about this forum was that it's not offensive--at all. I mean, if I wanted nice, I could have just talked to my co-workers or neighbours (this being Canada, after all).

Ah well, maybe someday some serious rudeness will emerge.

I live in flippin' hope.

[reuber1]

You all offend me. Kiss my ass. :p

http://static.flickr.com/21/37139747_5478528178_m.jpg