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I start college this fall to study graphic design. has anyone got any advice to help inclrease my chances of success. I understand that talent is the most important thing, but does anyone know what classes I should take and how I could go about learning what i need to learn for the job?
My plan so far is to attend a community college for two years and get my associates degree, i am also thinking about taking an out of degree elective class that teaches me a little about pre-press. On my second year of community college I plan to do an internship and transfer to a larger 4 year college to get my Bachelors degree. I have only just started to build my portfolio (is it too late?) when do most people start building a portfolio. I have been using computers for designing websites and drawing for about 6 years, since i was about 12 but unfortunately I diddnt save any work :(
I would appreciate any advice from you people who have been through college, and came out successfull or not(i keep getting scared that I wont succeed) I understand it takes a lot of hard work, but it will be worth it in the long run right?
Ilove graphic design, its fun and creative.
I like talking to the GD'S on this forum and I respect you all a lot, most of youhave worked very hard to get where you are I just hope I can do the same.
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
PrintDriver
07-06-2004, 01:57 AM
Give Liam some guidance people. He has foresight. Found him in another thread and he needs pro GD advice about what direction to take in school, not only what this print guy can tell him about learning prepress and the value of internships. Let's see if you 'teachers' out there can come up with a curriculum.
Liam, hope you can take some constructive criticism. One of the things you'll need in this biz is a tough skin (but that isn't an excuse for you GDFers to beat up with no mercy. Remember. Constructive).
PrintDriver is a large format digital print dude. His advice/opinions may not apply to the 4color/offset/web world of printing
Post Edited (PrintDriver) : 7/5/2004 10:03:37 PM GMT
thanks PD. well this isn't really something people can critisize is it? i'm just askin' for a little advice. I guess people can critisize my website (www.ice-design.ws) it needs a lot of work i know. I am getting more and more used to criticism because whenever i post a website for people too look at. i allways get quite a lot of criticism, i take most of it constuctively and use it to redesign stuff and it gets better and better.
Another thing, i was on yahoo chat the other week and there was a couple of people who were telling me not to go to college, and that most graphic designers are self taught because college is useless (are they wrong?) i came to the conclusion that they were probably college dropouts. They were very negative and were trying to tell me that i wont succeed. I want a degree in graphic design no matter what, but can you please tell me if college is worthwhille. I am going to college no matter what but i just wanted to make sure them yahoo chatters were wrong.
thanks
liam
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
D-Zine
07-06-2004, 05:11 AM
Ahh college - some people need the push and guidance and some just don't. It really depends on the person. I went to a 4 year college and got a BFA in GD. Without school I would have been lost. I wasn't such the 'go-getter' before college and didn't really think I was good enough to even make it into the college I went to. But I did. We have a big mix of both on this forum. Getting a job all comes down to your talent in the end. If you have a degree it may help you get the interview but its your portfolio that's gonna get you the job. So while you are in school - work towards your portfolio the entire time. Think of every piece you do as something that has to be great enough to be included in that book.
As far as classes...take some of everything. Really. You want to be well rounded in what you know. I think everyone has something they are strongest at in graphic design, whether it be layout, package design or whatever...but you need to be well rounded in what you know. There will be things you like to do and things you hate to do but learn about all of them. Learn as much software are you can. Quark, InDesign, Illustrator, Corel, Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Flash - take it all in.
Do an internship while still in school - paid or not paid. I wish I had done this. If you do this, try and take one doing pre-press. You will learn much more than you could ever learn in any class. I preach the importance of prepress all the time but I can't help it. It's really an important thing to understand. I had a professor tell me in college to 'form a good relationship with your printer, understand what they need from you. Otherwise you will think they are stupid and they will think you are stupid' He was right..100%! You have to have that communication! I have always followed that advice.
Oh and remember when you get outta college and into the real world, that to make it in Graphic Design..you have to put yourself out there. You have to make your success happen. You may take crap jobs in the beginning but you can learn alot at those jobs and they are what helps you get into the better positions! Don't listen to these ppl on yahoo telling you that you won't succeed. I'm not saying its easy bc it's not. What is!! and how the hell do they know if you will succeed or not? Again, you may or may not need school and the decision is up to you but don't listen to all that negatory input. You gotta have a tough skin as PD said, but if its what you really want then you can do it. Good luck! :o)
http://coastalcarousel.com/GDF/metatag3.jpg
thanks, one thin tho'. How do i go about getting an internship? Right now i am working on making websites for myself, and familly and friends. I am thinking that this will be a good way to build more of a portfolio. I have the determination and i believe i have the talent regardless of what other people think. A lot of people say that my personal website makes me look bad (www.ice-design.ws) and that it isn't very good as a portfolio. I mean i am going to keep working on my website and making it better and i am currently looking at a lot of Flash tutorials, that is what i think i like the most because you have so much creative freedom using flash for websites. As for print I will do some of that too once i have a few websites up and running (I can make business cards ect for the websites i make) ;)
I don't mind starting out at a crap graphic design job as long as i can get a job out of college, i will work VERY hard because for me graphic design would be the best career. It would be like not working a day as people say.
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
D-Frag
07-06-2004, 05:35 AM
shoot yourself
http://gallery.cybertarp.com/albums/userpics/13115/killer_cartoon.gif
D-Zine
07-06-2004, 05:43 AM
The school will help you get the internships. They usually (or atleast mine did) have a list of who is looking for interns and where. You could also just call places and ask if they are seeking interns. :o)
http://coastalcarousel.com/GDF/metatag3.jpg
D-Frag said...
shoot yourselfhuh? whats that suppossed to mean?
http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/emoticons/violent.gif<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>?
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
PrintDriver
07-06-2004, 03:32 PM
D-frag,
Having a bad day?
PrintDriver is a large format digital print dude. His advice/opinions may not apply to the 4color/offset/web world of printing
paulrandfan
07-06-2004, 10:14 PM
College (I think) is all based on circumstance. I know a guy whose parents are in the industry, so college for him would have been paying for everything his parents could provide. For me, having no background in the industry but some skill, college was great. It gives you a structured well rounded education not only in graphic design, but other mediums web design and art history. Everybody thinks differently but I feel that having a broad education has given me a little something extra, and has opened a lot of doors for further education. My work has a different look than that of my friends who didn't go to school, because college taughtme different ways of brainstorming, and thought process.Going to school also gave me connections to the industry, and the honor of meeting some very very important people. I was fortunate and got a job a month and a half out of school through some connections. As far as college type, that's more your preference. You said that you were considering a two, and then a four year. Two year degrees tend to be more technical experience, and four seem to be more...rounded towards the artistic end. I don't know if I would spend that much time, considering the pay on the outside doesn't seem to be affected the more school you have. I thought my four year degree was enough, and if you do an internship, you can pick up the technical skills that most 4 years tend to be more lacking in.
Internships: This is the one area I wish I would have done more of. I did a six month internship with the National Fish and Wildlife Museum (free, no pay). The school can definately put you in contact with internships, but other than that, you need to get your butt out there and find them yourself. I don't know where you are going to school, but I went to school in a small town, where there weren't a lot of opportunities. Most schools have a publication department, where they do all the school publications (brochures, posters and stuff). If they don't have jobs available there, ask to hang out for free. I know it sucks, but the experience is worth so much. My degree shows in my work, but when applying for a job, most places haven't seemed to care that I have a degree, they are more interested in experience. So I say, why not have both?
so down to my advice (from my success and regrets): Go to school, be open minded. Take advantage of every single opportunity you have, and don't be afraid to try new things, even if it means failing sometimes.As much as you'd like to, you aren't always going to succeed at everything you do, and that's not a bad thing.
I don't think talent really means sh#t. I know a lot of people with talent, but who have poor attitudes and poor work ethic. I think that most of your success comes from hard work, and open mind, good communication skillsand the ability to experiment. (again, an opinion). My greatest work and success, usually started out from a failure.
Silence04
07-06-2004, 10:40 PM
get as much software and serial numbers as you can.....LOL
<SUP>www.jdcgraphics.net (http://www.jdcgraphics.net/)<SUP>- currentlyunder construction
http://www.jdcgraphics.net/banner.gif
well, i plan to take a two year degree then CONTINUE it at a 4 year college,the community college will be very cheap then the four year college i will only be going to it for two years so it wont be too bad. i am thinking of cost effectiveness since it will all come down to my skills. experience and how hard i am willing to work, and belive me i am willing to work very hard to be where you guys are at
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
pixelmonkey
07-07-2004, 12:44 AM
Liam said...
well, i plan to take a two year degree then CONTINUE it at a 4 year college,the community college will be very cheap then the four year college i will only be going to it for two years so it wont be too badi would bet money on it taking more then 2 years at a 4 year college after you get your AS.
best advice, DONT DO A COMMUNITY COLLEGE FOR 2 YEARS!
before entering the community college there are a few things you should know.
1.) what credits will the 4 year accept that the 2 year offer.
2.) of those credits, which will actually apply to the degree you will be going for
3.) what is the max number of credit hours you can have and still be able to enroll in the 4 year college? *THIS IS IMPORTANT!!!* dont just check with the art college, but with the admissions office.
4.) what classes can you clep out of at the 2 year and NOT need to take at the 4 year.
5.) know which 4 year college you will attend before asking the above questions!
i know you dont want to hear it, but a college is out to make money. this means they will try to take advantage of you in any form they can.
if you arent worried about spending the $, the rest is easy.
chris<pixelmonkey>:D
the monkey makes all the girls bounce!
*i'm an aerobics instructor too*
well, actually i should have told you that it is an exchange program that integrates perfectly. the two year college degree transfers to the four year college, that was one of the first things i checked. ;) i may take a few out of degree electives tho' just to become more rounded and to learn some more technical stuff.
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
D-Zine
07-07-2004, 07:36 AM
Sounds like you know what you wanna do Liam so go for it! I will say that I do think that having talent means something. Otherwise we would be no different from the wannabe designers that come into the print shops we work at with brochures done in Publisher and Word...http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/emoticons/rofl.gif Come one guys....we've all been there. We have all had to fix their crap before....hehehe :oP
Anyways....you have a dream so go for it. http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/emoticons/cheers.gif
http://coastalcarousel.com/GDF/metatag3.jpg
thanks, i am glad that you all got my back on this, i will be talking to you as i go throught college and seek your wise guidance :) you all know best i have the drive and determination you can just point me in the right direction.
thanks again
Liam
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
Passmore
07-07-2004, 02:10 PM
Are most people on this site from britain?
Anybody here heard of Buckinghamshire and chilterns uni? Going there in september...
profound statement eh?
Big Perm-dizzle
07-07-2004, 04:40 PM
hell take a year off and intern and see if you can make it right now....your young and you have no bills now if the time
I wish I would have take six months to earn money then traveled europe on the money....its to late now for me....
JUST LAUNCHED - www.hirethisdesigner.com (http://www.hirethisdesigner.com) - check it out
defjoe
07-07-2004, 06:22 PM
work in the real world as much as possible.
also..portfolio is important not grades. no emeployer is gonna care if you got a 4.0.
'I will become the most powerful Jedi ever!'
my portfolio is my prority a have redesigned my website 3 times allready and i am working on another complete redesign. I may also help out some friends and familly to excercise my skills (and add to my portfolio) as well as the work i do in college. i am thinking about making a few differnt sites for myself, and i get a digital camera soon, so that will open up a lot more possiblilties whith my designs. well anyways i am very busy lerning some kewl flash stuff for my new design for my website because i try to make my website better everytime i redesign it. i have a job interview today for a day job (i am currently working in the evenings 4:30p-8:00p for the last two years) but i will soon be working around 8.00am to 5.00p then i will have college in the evenings. i am gonna be working hard but i need the money college is gonna be expensive, and gas prices are baaad right now (but they are getting lower :) i have a few bills to pay but i will have more this fall when i start college. oh well. i think what i will do is find out about getting an internship when i start college (like D-Zine said, the college should be able to help me get interships) but one question. I am going to be working from 8-5 then i will have college 3-4 nights a week, would i have the time to take an internship? could i get like an internship working just weekends?
thanks
Liam
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
pixelmonkey
07-08-2004, 12:01 AM
just a few other pointers for a college bound student...
ALWAYS
have an extra can of deoderant hidden somewhere *only you know where it's at*.
rain coats.
a second alarm clock. *one close to your bed, and the 2nd on the far side of the room so you have to get up
quarters. can never have too many, trust me!
2 places to sleep other then your own place. *not to wear out a welcome, but for the special occasions*
more rain coats!
a few phone / calling cards
an inexpensive digital camera does come in handy!
and for the love of god man, RAIN COATS!
if the above list doesnt make sence right now, just read it again in 1 year
chris<pixelmonkey>:D
the monkey makes all the girls bounce!
*i'm an aerobics instructor too*
ok, lol sounds funny but i will read it again once i am in college ;)
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
ylaenna
07-08-2004, 12:24 AM
Don't forget the rubbers.
RIGHT YOU ARE, KEN!
defjoe
07-08-2004, 12:35 AM
ya you don't want to get your feet wet...bring those rubbers.
Will you have time to do an internship? I would find the time. I'm sure some place... if open...will take you on weekends. your best bet is a printshop. Actually that is your only bet to find on weekends. Most firms and studios will be closed and if they are not they won't want to deal with you cause that means they are on deadline.
you seem to be listening to what you are hearing... keep with that attitude and you will have a head start by the time you are done with school.
'I will become the most powerful Jedi ever!'
i just love talking, i have got to be the most talkative person (i think it p's people off a bit) but i listen a lot too ;) (my parents would probably argue w/ that). Anyways i have figured that you know what you are talking about, and you are sooooo helpful. I post a message asking for advice about college then 3 days latter i get a whole book of replies pointing me in the right direction. thats great, and you giving me good advice thats easy to listen too ;)
Thanks Everyone, i know who i will be thanking when i am done whith college and successfully working in a graphic design career.
thanks again
Liam
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
oh and i will probably be asking you to look at a lot of my work whille i am in college ;) you will be able to watch me improve and grow as a graphic designer. I got the creativity but i am somewhat limited by not knowing certian things, that i will learn as i go through college. I am sure i will learn some kewl tricks when i am in college.
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
ylaenna
07-08-2004, 05:34 AM
Ahh, Liam, I have to thank you too. You've shown me that there is hope for today's youth. :D
RIGHT YOU ARE, KEN!
thanks ;) I Have a lot of ambition and I hope i will achieve my dreams, i just have to work real hard. I belive in myself and i'm glad you all back me up ;).
Anyways, tonite sucked, no1 was out :( oh well, i can't have fun every nite. i had a job interview today for a full time job, i hope i get it. I find out at the end of the week, then once i get that job i will be able to schedule may classes for fall.
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
paulrandfan
07-08-2004, 08:38 AM
I still don't get how having the two year will allow you to only spend two years at a four year program...what school is this? Most four year programs are structured for the four years, meaning you take a sequence of classes each semester, and there is no way to take more at once.
Working full time and going to school full time and trying an internship is a nightmare, and I know because I did it. You never get more than 4 hours of sleep, and according to my dentist I started grinding my teeth in my sleep because of the stress. An 8:00-5:00 commitment is going to be really really difficult to keep, while trying to be a strong student. Is there no way around that circumstance? You have a lot ambition and I admire you already, but that workload will kill you, and affect your design. I implore you not to do it. Do loans if you have to, do whatever you can not to have that workload. It was damaging to my health, and I really don't want to see someone else end up like that.
'To Design is much more than simply to assemble, to order, or even to edit; it is to add value and meaning, to illuminate, to simplify, to clarify, to modify, to dignify, to dramatize, to persuade, and perhaps even to amuse.' --Paul Rand
well heres how the degree works. You take the fist two years doing classes you would be doing if you was in the four year program, then you continue it at a four year college taking the rest of the classes and credit you need for a Bachelors degree. The workload wont be more than the last two years of high school for me. At high school i had class from 8:00am-3.06pm then i had work at 4:00pm-8.00pm. The difference is that i will only have college about 3 days a week 4 at the most. It shouldn't really be as bad as high school. I am really trying to do my first two years w/o getting much loans, my parents can't co-sign because of bad credit and i am still only 18, but when i start 4 year college i will get loans, and by then i should be a bit more financially secure. I know it will be hard, I will just have to get used to it. In the real world i am going to have a lot of tough times to get where i wanna be, but it will all be worth it in the end (i hope). If the workload is too much i can allways quit the day job i am about to get, but it should be like high school i will be working the same hours. and i will have weekends off :)
http://www.ice-design.ws/idv3_banner.png
http://www.ice-design.ws
Drorain
07-08-2004, 09:30 PM
i book or powerbook...and Educational versions of software...The comp is important by second year I think, i got mine late in college, but it helped me to be able to work anywhere I needed too
- Everyday, all the time, without fail!
I have a slow laptop right now, but i want to get a faster desktop that i can upgrade easier. My laptop is 300mhz, 32ram 9gb hd. its VERY outdated, but i can use dreamweaver, flash, photoshop it will do me for a couple of months. a tablet pc would be nice, but i will see how much i can save in a couple of months, i want a new car too ;)
http://www.ice-design.ws/id4_header.gif
http://www.ice-design.ws
plantationfarmer
07-16-2004, 10:57 AM
dont buy a tablet pc! its cool but its a wate of money.
invest on a desktop! cheaper and youll get more memory and speed and all...
forget pcs. buy a mac....
:i sell high quality sweet coconuts:
:call me:
:trust me:
yeah, i am thinning of getting a cheap dell pc or something, that i can upgade w/ better graphics card.
http://www.ice-design.ws/banner_small.gif
http://www.ice-design.ws
Big Perm-dizzle
07-19-2004, 02:11 AM
here is some advice..... dont go into any class with an ego thinking you know soooo much..... there is always something to learn.... and we (as professionals) are always learning also....
no one is perfect and all knowing in graphic design......
'put tools in the toolbox' the more you know, the more experiences you get will make you that much more valuable then the next guy applying for the job.....
Wayne: Our enemy is wicked, so...
J.D.: Dude, she's Freddy Krueger.
Wayne: Damien.
J.D.: Dude, she's Vader.
Wayne: No! She's the Emperor.
J.D.: Yeah, but with really great ****.
BuckarooB
07-19-2004, 02:49 AM
Take up welding. You'll make more money and have greater creative freedom.
I gave welded sculpture a go once and may do so again,
I gave it up some years back when the nude models complained of being burned by the sparks...
BB
No Matter Where You Go... There You Are.
perm- trust me, i know you think i have a huuugge ego but i dont. i have seen a lot of peoples work that are my age, and i need to learn a lot real quick, i am doing tutorials like crazy so i can acctually implement my idea's , i have loads of creativity, but when i say i am limeted i mean i have to learn ways to acctaully MAKE my ideas. it's pointless just being in my head, but i have my trusty scetchbook. when i enter the college classes i will do everything as a first timer, i will have the attitude that i have a lot to learn in four years but whith your help i can do it, just dont get the wrong idea, i dont have an ego at all (i know you think i do) i have a lot of room for improvement, but that just means i can improve a lot right? and as for adding tools to the tool box, do you think doing lots of online tutorials on Flash,Photoshop. Ect. is the way to go? as well as the stuff i learn in college, but i am kinda planning on learning stuff on my own as well as college.
BuckarooB- well i took shop class, i have done wood work class in england. but it realy isnt my thing, i find it a lot easier to make stuff on computers than the MANUAL LABOR. i was allways best at CAD/CAM that would be interesting but graphic design is waaaay more creative. I have a best friend in england that works at a woodwork place, that was HIS thing, my thing has always been computers and artwork on computers. i have never picked up a welder, i dont think i would like it. the only welding i would ever do would be on my car, i loooooove cars. but thats a hobby kinda thing, in the long run i like making websites, designing logos, and maybye even designing vynil decals for the side of a car would be kewl. who knows. but i considerd doing accounting earlier this year, but it diddnt last long when i realized that i dont like nothing more than graphic design. and i start liking it more and more.
(long int it.) thats talkativeness for ya' ;)
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http://www.ice-design.ws
plantationfarmer
07-19-2004, 04:09 PM
dunt by a dell. mine sucks!!!!!
weld your own...
:i sell high quality sweet coconuts:
:call me:
:trust me:
I recomend Beer!!! /emoticons/cheers.gif
Cuda
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