Screen Printing HELP>>>

[mattmainster]

Hello all,

I do Graphic Design/ Pre-Press for a print shop in So. California and am extremely interested in screen printing. My only problem is where to start. I am somewhat familiar with the process, but have no idea what kind of euqiptment to start out with. For the time being, it will just be for personal use (friends, family, myself...) but eventually for profit. Any input/ suggestions on equiptment will be appreciated.

THANK YOU!

[Logo-Mechanix]

Silk screening can be a very messy chemically dependent hobby. I create alot of illustration/art for silk screening and also offer the actual silk screening to my clients although I do not do it myself I job it out. When I first became interested in offereing this I looked into the cost of doing it myself and came to the conclusion that it was too time intensive to really make money doing on your own unless you invested in a fairly expensive machine that can handle multiple items. As a hobby I think you could probobly start out fairly cheap but you will be doing items one at a time and there is some issues with screening dark garments I know the printer I use charges about 10% extra, it's called flashing. I would google silk sceening and see what you come up with.

[mattmainster]

Silk screening can be a very messy chemically dependent hobby. I create alot of illustration/art for silk screening and also offer the actual silk screening to my clients although I do not do it myself I job it out. When I first became interested in offereing this I looked into the cost of doing it myself and came to the conclusion that it was too time intensive to really make money doing on your own unless you invested in a fairly expensive machine that can handle multiple items. As a hobby I think you could probobly start out fairly cheap but you will be doing items one at a time and there is some issues with screening dark garments I know the printer I use charges about 10% extra, it's called flashing. I would google silk sceening and see what you come up with.

Thanks for the quick response. I am not worried about getting in to mulitple items just yet, but just looking to do some one or two color personal stuff for the time being.
I have heard good things about the Speedball Kit (http://www.dickblick.com/zz449/24/). Anyone have any experience with this or any other reccomendations?

Thanks!

[Logo-Mechanix]

You may want to consider sublimation, I think for this all you need an Epson printer and a heat press. A local customer of mine offers this and the results, while not silk screening, are not bad. Although dark colors do not work all that well.

[Danger_Mouse]

Sublimation is fair better quality than Silk Screening although it will depend on the type of printer and heat press. You get what you pay for, let's just say that. Colors shouldn't be an issue, if anything thats one of the selling points. It's more vibrant and on top of that you can sublimated on any "poly" substance. The company I work for switched to sublimation about 6 years ago and we sublimate on fabrics to produce sport jerseys, much more durable and vibrant than screen printing. We do it in mass quantity or small quantity, its doesn't matter cost wise in production like it does in screen printing. In Screen printing this is a factor, who wants to burn a screen etc for 5 pieces?

Screen printing is a dying industry in my opinion, there will always be a place for it, but there are now other options that are more economic.
The NHL with Rebok has just jumped on board with the launch of the "new" NHL uniforms, being lighter, less apt to soak sweat etc. All being sublimated.
Nike is doing it as well.

[Logo-Mechanix]

From what I remember Danger here is far better at sublimation questions than I am but I still believe there is an issue with dark garments or even off white, it is possible they have overcome that one but I don't think thats the case. As for silk screening being a dying industry, I don't think I would go that far but hey, you never know. The latest thing now is DTG ot direct to garment, what are your thoughts on this Danger?

[Danger_Mouse]

The key Logo, is starting EVERYTHING white, buying the white fabric
then sublimating the colors and designs. Yeah you are going to have issues sbulimating to black fabric. Just use white all the time. If you need red, sublimate red.

DTG printing I have read and heard about, and from what I understand hasn't quite caught up to sublimation yet. (although I am sure it will). Most printers set up for this are small scale, usually Tshirt runs. Not sure how it does on mass quantity.
I know our company is keeping a watchful eye on this concept though.

No I guess I dont think Screen printing is a dying industry, its just not the only option now.

A flaw in sublimation or at least one of ours is color management. The solution is Color Mapping on the printers to keep the blacks on one printer consistant to the black on another. While Color Mapping solves this, it does not work with Bitmaps etc and this has been a major factor for us on a color management issue that we are still working on.

[Logo-Mechanix]

I agree there are far more options available now than ever before and thats a good thing. The thing that always interested me about sublimation was being able to print something full color without going with costly 4 color process in screen printing. From what I have read with DTG you still have to use a heat press afterwards to set the inks otherwise they will smudge. That, and I think the machines a fairly costly.

[Danger_Mouse]

With DTG too you are not limited to Poly surfaces. I think you can do to 100% cotton.

And if you still have to use heat press in DTG then I would go sublimation right away.

We are waiting and hoping for printers rolled with paper and fabric getting heat treated and coming out voila finished. All in one swoop. Apparently its in the works.

[mattmainster]

Thanks again for the quick responses, however I am only looking for something inexpensive (1 or 2 color) for personal projects. Dye-sublimation is something that we occasionaly get requests for at work and sublet out.
The quality is great on white fabrics!
Back on topic, I am still looking for some sort of "kit" or somehing similar to start with. Any input is greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[Danger_Mouse]

NOT familiar with anything on a small level like that.
Let me know what you find though, I would be interested.

sorry for going off topic heh heh

[mattmainster]

No Prob DangerMouse
The only thing I've seen so far is this (http://www.dickblick.com/zz449/24/). I have read mixed reviews on it. What do you think?

[Danger_Mouse]

I will have to get bakc to you. Job interview . later

[budafist]

Check into a screen printing class at your local community arts centre.

Our local arts centre have classes - Also you can hire out the screen exposure room and equipment for the ridiculously low price of $40 per hour. How many screens could you expose in an hour? Enough to keep you printing for a while that's for sure.

Doing it yourself from scratch is great and all, but better get some experience first and then you can see what you are up against.

[mattmainster]

Check into a screen printing class at your local community arts centre.

Our local arts centre have classes - Also you can hire out the screen exposure room and equipment for the ridiculously low price of $40 per hour. How many screens could you expose in an hour? Enough to keep you printing for a while that's for sure.

Doing it yourself from scratch is great and all, but better get some experience first and then you can see what you are up against.

Thanks, I just might do that.

[Workshy]

The only problem with sublimation is that it only works on man made materials. No good for cotton. Most tees are cotton.
Basic screen printing is quite easy but multi color work especially on dark garments does require some equipment.
Jobbing it out involves set up costs (screen/art/film) for initial prints but these should be a one off cost and actual printing should be pretty reasonable

[Danger_Mouse]

Check into a screen printing class at your local community arts centre.
Great idea buda. I think would be the best solution for this scenario.

The only problem with sublimation is that it only works on man made materials. No good for cotton. Most tees are cotton.

I think I mentioned that.....only poly fabrics can be sublimated on. And you can sublimate on cotton as long as it is not 100%. I am not sure the percentage of poly that has to be in it, but we have sublimated on cotton before (60%) I think.

As for the dark garment thing, a nice layer of white before other colors can usually fix that up, not perfect of course but it works.
Most screen printers won't want to set up screens for just a couple of tshirts unless there was some type hint that more would be done in future. Especially for full color images.
Ever have to wash and burn screens for a full process logo? Not too bad on its own, but if you have 30 others orders to do....pain in the butt unless you have a system to band different logos all together.

[Drazan]

Just a note on the kits. You generally get either a stencil or a masking solution for the screen vs the comercial thermographic screens.

http://www.enasco.com/top/419/Kits/
Although not a pro set up there's other kits here and usually less expensive than anywhere else.

[steve2112]

in the paerl art store near me they have a speedbal opaque fabric printing kit. Though i never needed it the kit is a good start. We use i belive a 200 watt bulb and a metallic cone/reflector. It works pretty good. I always you film positives and not transparencies from a copier.

steve

[Logo-Mechanix]

The screen printer I use does a minimum of 24 for screen printing and I think 48 for 4 color process.

[budafist]

I've always wanted to screenprint my own shirts to keep and sell too - so I did check out my local art centre.

They have 2 options: a 2 and a half hour class on Tuesdays 6.30pm - 9pm for 8 weeks for $310NZ or $214US.

Or they have a weekend workshop to learn 10am - 4pm for Saturday and Sunday which is $200NZ or $138US.

While the weekend one is good to get it done and over with, I think I prefer to absorb infomation over 8 weeks. Just me. I'm going to talk my bf into doing this with me I think.

If you don't have these classes available to you where you are, you can just move to New Zealand :D

[mattmainster]

If you don't have these classes available to you where you are, you can just move to New Zealand :D

Maaannnn...I wish...I can't seem to find classes anywhere around me.