Converting an RGB doc to 2 Spot - a few questions

[DesignVHL]

Ok so I'm working on some diagrams for an architect who needed a few drawings converted from an exported PDF file from Vector works to two spot colors (Black - C Swatch, and a green pantone)....

I've gone through and selected each tone/value/color and assigned it the proper pantone swatches throughout, as well as proper tints....each element has been changed. However, when I go to select unused swatches, the white and black originally in the document (that got changed) does not get selected.....so I assume that means that the RGB white and black are still "there" somehow? When I tried to open the file at work into a lower version of Illy (got cs2 at home, only cs at work), it needs to convert - and said there were cmyk and rgb elements on the page...but when I put create a white box (and same for the black) and then do a select all fills (or strokes), nothing gets selected because I changed them all to spot! I want to be sure this file only has the two spot colors I need, and that there will be no problems at the printers.

Now, when I import the files into inDesign (just for my own preflight check on the files), the two pantone colors are added to the swatches, as expected...however I am not sure if the White and Black RGB swatches are really gone and that the eps files will be perfectly fine for print.

How can I tell if these files will be ok and that they really only contain the two spot colors?

I hope I have clearly explained my possible problem here, and if you have any thoughts or advice I'd greatly appreciate it.

Thanks guys!

[Kool]

Easiest way would be to just print all the seps either to pdf or to paper and see what shows up on the unwanted colors.

[DesignVHL]

How do I do that? I honestly never have done that before - usually my printers take care of the color seps (tho I 'd learn and do it if they preferred me to, lol)...

How would I know though - its only white and black the green color is def. all pantone, because the original file was greyscaled w/ black, grey and white rgb values - this diagram is EXTREMELY detailed....if I can't get rid of these "unused" swatches does that mean that an rgb white or black is still in there? Or is it kind of an illustrator bug? Or if it looks like it printed ok in the PDF seps or on paper, it'll be fine when it goes to the printer? I don't want the printer to get the file and then come back and say there are rgb elements on the page...even tho i set the pantones, it won't work...or will it??

Thanks for the response kool...

[Virgo Nightingale]

Have you tried printing separations to see if there's anything on those plates?

Edit: Oops! Way too slow! :D

To print the seps: in the print dialog, the option for separations is usually under the "Output" tab.

[Two-Toe Tom]

have you deleted all the unused swatches in the illustrator file? indesign doesn't let me remove a swatch if an illustrator file has that swatch, even tho the swatch is unused.

[DesignVHL]

i'm just supplying illlustrator (flattened EPS) files to the printer/book publisher - i....I really don't need to put it in ID just did that as a 'test'.....but when I go to SELECT ALL UNUSED SWATCHES in illy, the white and black DO NOT get selected, as I would hope they would have....

When I opened the file, I didn't have any swatches open/added....so I selected the colors that were already in the file...but they all got changed...I KNOW there is nothing rgb used in the actual diagram...but they may still be there somewhere. I could delete the swatches...but that doesn't mean they aren't there....

Is there a way to find and isolate any RGB elements that might be used - that I may have missed? Ugh lol maybe the file is fine and I am worrying for nothing...I just don't want the client to come back to me and say the printer said the file won't work because it contains RGB elements - when I am pretty sure they were all changed to spots!!! Thats what he hired me for! I have to make sure these are perfect!!! :)

[DesignVHL]

UGH ok, so i went to the output tab and it is showing cmyk inks + the two pantones used..I'm not sure what could be going on here! I have used spot colors before in illy of course, but from scratch, not a conversion.....The only thing I seem to be able to do is change the emulsion. I don't see how to print the color seps...perhaps there are CMYK elements on there, ugh, that need to be removed? I have no idea how to make this right...

[Two-Toe Tom]

have you tried deleting the swatches you don't want in the swatch palette? does it let you?

[Kool]

Go ahead and print the CMYK seps, thenm you'll be able to see exactly what elements are still in those colors.

[Virgo Nightingale]

Print out the seps, and see what's on the plates. If they're blank, my next step would be to select the objects you KNOW are using the correct colors (a "select same" sort of thing) and paste them into a new blank document. Hopefully, the swatches you don't want (and the elements tied to them) won't follow.

[DesignVHL]

Only the two spot color plates printed...cmyk pages are all blank....does that mean all is good?

Tom - yes the only swatches showing in my pal. are the black and green spots....however when i originally opened the file, no swatches were added to my already empty pal....so i added the white and black used....and deleted them after I converted to spots - when i went to select all unused...they did not select but i deleted em anyways because I didn't want them used.

[DesignVHL]

so should I really paste into a new doc? Is that necessary to get rid of cmyk colors not used?

Also file should be in rgb mode for spots/pantones to printer right? I think that someone told me that once but now i'm not sure lol!

[emucru]

I'm not sure about printing in Illy but in ID you can use Ink Alias to map colours to other swatches. For example map "undesired swatch to 1 spot colour"

[Virgo Nightingale]

I wouldn't think you'd have to copy and paste everything into a new doc, I've had stuff with extra blank plates print just fine. That suggestion was just a way to get rid of them if you knew it would be necessary. Call the printer if you can, let them know the issue and ask whether they think the extra blank plates will cause them problems.

As far as the mode, I've honestly never paid attention. As long as the printer uses the ink I've specified... :D

[DesignVHL]

that is essentially the same thing as "merge swatch" in illy....and after printing the color seps from illy, it is apparent that I am not using an cmyk or rgb swatches...only my two spot colors...however why would it ask me to print the cmyk plates if no rgb/cmyk values are being used.

When i try to open the eps file, since it is an earlier version of illy i have to open it w/ at work, (i use cs2 at home) it asks to import but says there are rgb and cmyk elements and i need to pick a mode to open it with...i assume this is part of the issue, and one of the reasons i am weary that the printer may send my file back due to these elements "still there" even tho they are not printing!

Hmmm maybe pasting into a new doc would be best...the only issue i have is that if I paste the black and green spots separartly that they don't paste right - layers are really intermingled - and again this is a very detailed drawing - that the client is still having me make changes on (just color values really) lol!!! So it goes!

[jimking]

Easy way to view seperations in Indy is to go to "Window-output-seperation preview" in the dialog box activate seperations and click off and on the colors. If you only have CS not sure if this version has the preview seperation preview or not.

[DesignVHL]

I wouldn't think you'd have to copy and paste everything into a new doc, I've had stuff with extra blank plates print just fine. That suggestion was just a way to get rid of them if you knew it would be necessary. Call the printer if you can, let them know the issue and ask whether they think the extra blank plates will cause them problems.

As far as the mode, I've honestly never paid attention. As long as the printer uses the ink I've specified... :D



I have no communication with the printer...rather NOT deal with it, however I am sure I could get a hold of them after getting that info from my client...who is working with the printer who I'm not even sure is their printer or their designer who is putting the book together! All i know is that I was hired to convert diagrams - and this new client is going to for sure lead to a ton of other work, as he's been happy w/ my work so far...so I don't wanna screw this up! I need another steady client!! :)

[DesignVHL]

again, not using ID - just used it once for a plate check.....:) it is all illy really - just gotta get final flat print ready happy spot colored eps files to their printer or book designer (again no clarity on that one).

also just wanted to thank you guys again for the help i know i probably sound like a pain in the tush! :P

[DesignVHL]

ok now client needs these two images converted to spots...i keep suggesting duotones because i cannot vector these maps....but when i try to do a nice duotone mix, the black text gets greenish, and the maps look "muddy" - any thoughts on how to make this look nice in two color? I know I know the images aren't that great to begin w/ but they want to use them....I never use duotones so i'm not sure what would be the best setup for these...i tried a few different preset ps ones....all look so muddy! IS there a setting to make the blacks stay black and the greens shaded right w/out my having to layout the text in black separately in ID or something, then import a duotoned image of just the maps in? I would rather not supply the printer/designer w/ a PDF file...tho i suppose I could Export as an EPS file which would include the proper information to print correctly?

http://expandyourelement.com/projects/fig1.jpg

http://expandyourelement.com/projects/fig2.jpg

I was thinking of going all greyscale and having it just print in either the green or black pantone....thoughts?

thanks! sorry again guys, really appreciate your thoughts on this....this project should be done by tonight...