HOW is a money whore

[Kesh]

Conference: $1000
In-HOWse Conference: $1000
Stupid webinars: $69
MP3's and videos from their rip-off conferences: who knows, more cash
Design contests: probably more cash you pay just to lose

Anyone else notice their whorish-ness?

[benjo]

I've been to there conferences and I have to say they are great. Yes they are pricey but they definitely have quality sessions.

[Broacher]

?? Market will bear. I don't see the problem. If they didn't sell out, then you complaint might have a leg to stand on.

The 'extras' (videos, contests)-- if your don't want 'em, don't buy em. Do you expect them to develop these for nothing? (Would you?)

Only wish I could afford them. But I still have benefitted from a lot of free or even low-cost advice that they have shared with everyone.

[Drazan]

Actually there are several business seminars that charge simular and sometimes even more than that. It's to cater to a limited and specific clientel.

The cost of putting on a seminar or small convention is astronomical. And no envy to those people who manage such things.

unfortunately, I'm not in the position to even think about going to one of these types of conferences. I'll stick to gathering info from the websites and forums.

Jade

[SurfPark]

One thing I think HOW does is shut out all non-corporate designers. Their pricing tells me they are mainly for B2B design. Not many freelancers will be able to afford their materials.

I feel HOW caters far too much to the design illuminati. I'm looking at their August 2007 issue, and notice that one of the spreads is just about the slick interior design of a Seattle firm's offices. I'm sure this is material many of their readers find out of touch.

Most of the articles in this magazine are about the work of firms. Rightly so, they charge fees that medium sized firms can afford. I think its terrible because most of the design world is not in this work situation. Many of us are at very small firms, freelancers, or in-house designers. Their market exists in a bubble in which the cap spent on design is seemingly endless.

Its this reason that I let my subscription run out. The writing is good. The photos are fantastic. I just cannot relate to anything in it. I am a little envious of the designers featured within the pages, as they always seem to have these national accounts with a 6 month+ timeline. Dare to dream I suppose.

What I'd like to know is if any one here has attended a conference. If so, who paid for it? How did you manage the funding? Would you go again?

[Broacher]

One thing I think HOW does is shut out all non-corporate designers. Their pricing tells me they are mainly for B2B design. Not many freelancers will be able to afford their materials.

Um... I'm a corporate designer. There is NO way the PTB would ever agree to that kind of 'staff development'. Nah, it's just one of those 'sigh and move on' things for me.

[SurfPark]

I meant to say non-design firm designers. It seems that a design firm would be the only one willing to pay this amount of money for staff development.

[budafist]

I have yet to gather up the courage this year or the previous 2 years to ask my boss to send me to a $140 design conference. $1000? Ha.

[PrintDriver]

There's a print conference in October that is $500 depending on the package you buy. $500 gets you into as many seminars as you want. Plus the hotel room and flight costs. But $35 will get you on the Expo floor and that will suit me just fine. HOW doesn't do much of an Expo floor. A few print sponsers etc. But their speaker list is usually pretty good. Someone has to pay the fees for that as well. I know these things are a bugger to run but I think they are missing a great Expo opportunity.

Broacher, any idea what the average attendance is at a HOWie-con?

And any money you pay is because you want to. There are things far less important in life that cost more than a $30 contest fee. If the contest is juried properly and well-run and the prize/honor is worth it to you, $25-50 is pretty average to enter work in a juried contest. Paying to enter contests for contests' sake? If it's your hobby do it. If it's your living, kinda silly.

I have no problem with HOW charging what they do. I think it's a little steep and would never go but I'm not enough of a designer now to care. But the discontent the cost stirs does show that there will never, ever be a consensus on where the demarkation would fall in a licensing situation if Designers ever figured out a way to organize. ;)

Why does showcasing the Illuminati bother you? I like looking at some of the corporate spaces of the various design studios. I've done some installs in some Boston office spaces that have been really cool and visited many design studios that fall anywhere from uber-urban to comfy-homey. Both types just as successful and on the same level. I've never had a 'thing' against those who make it or decide to go for the "look". Believe me, you can marthastewart a "look" on a shoestring budget if you wanted to. If you look at an article like that from a design standpoint rather than an "I can't afford anything like that," maybe you would appreciate the article more.

It's also interesting to hear some of the current wonder-dogs' stories on how they 'made it'. And trying to guess which one is just a flash in the pan. LOL.

I also like looking at magazines or online articles that show me new program tools, techniques, and those all important trade secrets. I don't particularly look at HOW magazine because I'm not fond of their forum culture (sorry Broacher). They have some good tech guys in the Hardware and Software sections, so I do browse those once in a while to see if there are any interesting problems or programs kicking around. Lots of bleeding edge line waiters over there. Crash test dummies for software releases. Contributed too, for a while, until the kiddies pissed me off and I scrambled my password. (Not as PrintDriver - the kiddies woulda jumped on that in an instant. LOL! Oh well...)

[Broacher]

>>I also like looking at magazines or online articles that show me new program tools, techniques, and those all important trade secrets. I don't particularly look at HOW magazine because I'm not fond of their forum culture (sorry Broacher)<<

No need to apologize PD, I'm more of less of the same opinion. I was once addicted to the place and amazed at the level of pro discussion there-- but something happened when it got too inbred and self-absorbed to the point where if you missed a day or so you were lost. Not to say I still don't appreciate it still-- like you, I found the software/hardware threads very interesting-- and there was a time when the crit section was awesome. And even so, there are some amazing people still wandering about that I have very fond and cool vibes for.

Back to the confs-- one of our forum guys is now a regular featured presenter: Jeff Fisher, and quite a hit, with or without his underwear. (See? Another HOW insider story!)

[PrintDriver]

Based on his writing, I'm sure Jeff is a talented speaker. I'm not so sure I want to know about his underwear though...:p

[frankster]

Sure Broacher, but I want it all! I'm curious about most stuff. What colour is your underwear? ;)

Hm, maybe I should venture over to HOW. :eek: ;)

[Seapony]

>>I also like looking at magazines or online articles that show me new program tools, techniques, and those all important trade secrets. I don't particularly look at HOW magazine because I'm not fond of their forum culture (sorry Broacher)<<

No need to apologize PD, I'm more of less of the same opinion. I was once addicted to the place and amazed at the level of pro discussion there-- but something happened when it got too inbred and self-absorbed to the point where if you missed a day or so you were lost. Not to say I still don't appreciate it still-- like you, I found the software/hardware threads very interesting-- and there was a time when the crit section was awesome. And even so, there are some amazing people still wandering about that I have very fond and cool vibes for.
Oh, but if they were to hear you now...especially since they recently named you on a list of top fantasy HOWie hotties—even if it was a crossover man crush. :D

Seriously though (I bring this up only because it seems relative to the temporary hijack and I thought you'd be interested to know), they still ask for you over there often...and every now and again on About. I must learn your secret for leaving them asking for more "Roach." ;)

Regarding HOW, I also agree that the forum isn't what it once was, particularly the Crit and Lounge. I sometimes wonder whether that's necessarily a "bad" thing looking back, but I digress. For good or ill, it is what it is now.

Regarding the Mag itself, there have been occassions where the Editors will post threads to bounce off ideas/thoughts on upcoming topics in their issues, so that tells me that they do try to keep their pulse on the needs of the design community every now and again. I feel the business sections are where to go for some interesting industry discussions, but every so often the Lounge still doles out it's doozies.

Though I'm not a subscriber or conference veteran, I've heard tell that as expensive as it may seem, particularly to "non-corporate" designers, they do their best to pull out all the stops to commensurately give you what you pay for. Every year I'm told, it's always a little bit better than the last, if not a little bit crazier, too. That's what has convinced me to attempt to attend their 2008 conference in Boston (the quality, not because it's getting crazier...I actually dislike throngs, they wreak havoc with my "personal space" sensibilites ;)).

And I also agree with PD on pretty much everything he's said. I also am inspired by success stories and swanky looking digs. Gives me hope that somewhere out there, someone in this industry broke through and became successful. If I'm determined, talented and wily enough, I may make it to the mountaintop myself someday. What drove me to forego the mag for an extended hiatus, were all the ads.

:)

[Seapony]

Hm, maybe I should venture over to HOW. :eek: ;)

I must've missed that particular "Show us..." thread. Good thing there's a search engine in there.

:D:p

[Broacher]

>>Oh, but if they were to hear you now...especially since they recently named you on a list of top fantasy HOWie hotties—even if it was a crossover man crush.<<

Did I say they had gone off track?

QED!

Flattered, I guess. And like I said, I really like and admire so many folks over there, but I just can't handle the kind of virtual soci0-pro commitment that almost seems demanded over there. I confess that I have a real problems with names and people--even (especially?) virtual people! (Witness how I just clued into the fact that 'Seapony' was a regular HOWie name) But another, perhaps bigger component is that the members there--most of the core ones, any how, seem to have made huge commitments to regularly getting together in 'real space', or at the very least, to party together at the big annual conf. After a while, I started to feel like the only 'regular' who was out of the non-virtual loop. And being geographically and financially challenged, that wasn't going to change. Maybe it was my own insecurities coming out, but after a while (a long while, actually) I just felt that I was eavesdropping on a bunch of close friends that I would never meet. I don't think it was an intentional result on anyone's part, it just rolled out that way.

See, and that's what I like about the GDF. As far as I know, most of you guys here are happy enough with virtual friendship and in fact, can find the real advantage of maintaining that kind of seutp. I mean, you take a guy like Alan, a real type whiz-- he doesn't wave it about, or drag out his port every chance he gets. I like that the mix here of seasoned pros and beginners is not so obvious. It's just, you know-- cool! (Kool?)

Maybe what happened with HOW is that it kind of became a victim of its own success. The mag and the HOW group have made tremendous, pioneering strides in flipping over the ancient formula of so many designer-trade venues: showcase the superstars, and discuss superstar issues, and has almost single handedly been the first mag to seriously bring the issues of the 'regular Josephine/Joe' designer into the light. I can't thank them enough for having the courage to do that and I am pleased for them for their success.

BUT, maybe that success is why the HOW forum (geez, now I feel like I'm gonna be quoted here) appears to be less of an open forum, and more intimidating to many shyer members of the GD tribe. Afterall, it IS the HOW mag site. It true that it does have a very high 'star' content and they are not afraid to sparkle their collective and often 'inside' wits while idling about there. If you're not up on the current 'HOWie-scene' details, or the history of the 'cast' it comes across as almost a different language. But that's mostly in the water cooler forum. But that's mostly where people discuss things! And from a structural standpoint, I think one of the things GDF (and it's marvelous mods) has over the HOW forum is the vigilance in keeping the right discussions in the right place. And, though I am certainly not innocent of breaking the house rules here-- I really do appreciate the effort to keep things civilized, and even PG here, when needed. In person, I find that I'm almost devoid of profanity. It's kind of a habit. I don't mind it in its place, but I just never developed much of an immunity to it when used in the workplace. (See? That's why I could never do agency work!) But that too was something that really got to me-- albeit, slowly-- at the HOW forum. Throw in too many long celebrity discussion and/or hormone-induced threads, and I just got tired of 'trolling' through that kind of muck. But there were (are?) still some awesome discussions and just achingly lovely people there that I truly miss. In a way, that's like saying I dumped my girlfriend cause she was too good for me. Yeah, maybe. But sometimes that just feels like the right move.

To all my HOWie fans (hi Mom! Hi Sis!)-- forget about me! I'm no good for you!! (And please, no more drive-by frontal exposures-- it's upsetting the family.)

(Gyuck. If anyone is really fantasizing about me they should seriously be checking out psychiatry forums!)

Take it Elvis: "Thank you, thank you very much."

[Red Kittie Kat]

Oh, but if they were to hear you now...especially since they recently named you on a list of top fantasy HOWie hotties—even if it was a crossover man crush

They really have a list like that? :confused:

[PrintDriver]

Oh, probably. In the early days of the GDF I think we had one too...now since lost (I didn't know anything could get lost on the internet).

[Red Kittie Kat]

Well if it's its here or has been Mo will know :D

[Kool]

I might have deleted it since I didn't make it on the list ;)

[Red Kittie Kat]

lmao Kool :D

[frankster]

Aw Broacher. You sound a little heartbroken. Well, if HOW is your "Madonna" then we'll be your "whore". :)

[PrintDriver]

I didn't either, Kool. LOL!

[Red Kittie Kat]

btw ... Kool is looking a bit more whiskery than usual :D

Frank ... you kill me :D

[Kool]

btw ... Kool is looking a bit more whiskery than usual :D

Frank ... you kill me :D

Morea loaned me some since Spug tore mine off because he was mad at PD.

[Red Kittie Kat]

I must have missed that one .... shame on Spug :D

I thought they looked moreaishly familar :D

[Seapony]

>>Oh, but if they were to hear you now...especially since they recently named you on a list of top fantasy HOWie hotties—even if it was a crossover man crush.<<

Did I say they had gone off track?

QED!

Flattered, I guess. And like I said, I really like and admire so many folks over there, but I just can't handle the kind of virtual soci0-pro commitment that almost seems demanded over there. I confess that I have a real problems with names and people--even (especially?) virtual people! (Witness how I just clued into the fact that 'Seapony' was a regular HOWie name)...
I have an irrational fear of identity thieves. :D

...But another, perhaps bigger component is that the members there--most of the core ones, any how, seem to have made huge commitments to regularly getting together in 'real space', or at the very least, to party together at the big annual conf. After a while, I started to feel like the only 'regular' who was out of the non-virtual loop. And being geographically and financially challenged, that wasn't going to change. Maybe it was my own insecurities coming out, but after a while (a long while, actually) I just felt that I was eavesdropping on a bunch of close friends that I would never meet. I don't think it was an intentional result on anyone's part, it just rolled out that way.

See, and that's what I like about the GDF. As far as I know, most of you guys here are happy enough with virtual friendship and in fact, can find the real advantage of maintaining that kind of seutp. I mean, you take a guy like Alan, a real type whiz-- he doesn't wave it about, or drag out his port every chance he gets. I like that the mix here of seasoned pros and beginners is not so obvious. It's just, you know-- cool! (Kool?)
I have to agree with you there. There seems to be a clique within a clique between those who have met other HOWies and the same folks who cavort every day with others they haven't met on the forum. Quite natural, all things considered, but I have to say, these distinctions aren't as obvious as they once were, say, two years ago when the old forum interface was in place. And even though I haven't met anyone from there myself, I don't feel particularly bad or left out as a result. I do however feel that I probably would've felt that way a couple of years ago, which is why I lurked there during that period more often than not.

I also find that the forum culture between all the design forums have a level of cliqueness anyway. Like it or not, we end up forming virtual bonds that sometimes end up spilling into the real world (I know a few of you have met other GDF'ers here). Don't worry though, I'm certain there is a huge contingent that is willing to travel to your neck of the woods just to see you. Hey, maybe we can have our first annual "Broacher Convention" yeaaaa....;)

...BUT, maybe that success is why the HOW forum (geez, now I feel like I'm gonna be quoted here) appears to be less of an open forum, and more intimidating to many shyer members of the GD tribe. Afterall, it IS the HOW mag site. It true that it does have a very high 'star' content and they are not afraid to sparkle their collective and often 'inside' wits while idling about there. If you're not up on the current 'HOWie-scene' details, or the history of the 'cast' it comes across as almost a different language. But that's mostly in the water cooler forum. But that's mostly where people discuss things! And from a structural standpoint, I think one of the things GDF (and it's marvelous mods) has over the HOW forum is the vigilance in keeping the right discussions in the right place. And, though I am certainly not innocent of breaking the house rules here-- I really do appreciate the effort to keep things civilized, and even PG here, when needed. In person, I find that I'm almost devoid of profanity. It's kind of a habit. I don't mind it in its place, but I just never developed much of an immunity to it when used in the workplace. (See? That's why I could never do agency work!) But that too was something that really got to me-- albeit, slowly-- at the HOW forum. Throw in too many long celebrity discussion and/or hormone-induced threads, and I just got tired of 'trolling' through that kind of muck. But there were (are?) still some awesome discussions and just achingly lovely people there that I truly miss. In a way, that's like saying I dumped my girlfriend cause she was too good for me. Yeah, maybe. But sometimes that just feels like the right move.
I'll agree that it was once the case, but not quite so now. As a matter of fact, many of the regulars you once knew from the "old forum" have left because of their disdain for this "kinder, gentler, PC" HOW. I won't name names, but there have been more than one occassion where this has been avidly debated by new and veteran members. I suspect that some of those who left feel as though the spice that set the HOW forum apart from all the other sites is now dead.

I count myself as one of those initial "shy lurkers." For a good year I would log on as a guest and bear witness to all the myths about the forum—the cliques, the scathing critiques, the sarcasm, the overall raunchiness and political debates. I wasn't shy so much as I felt that I would immediately end up virtually clashing heads because I wouldn't allow anyone to be petulant with me. I didn't want to introduce myself through a conflict (even though it sort of happened anyway) so I didn't bother. I have to say things aren't what they once were. I also sometimes question if that's for the better (particularly in the critique section).

To all my HOWie fans (hi Mom! Hi Sis!)-- forget about me! I'm no good for you!! (And please, no more drive-by frontal exposures-- it's upsetting the family.)

(Gyuck. If anyone is really fantasizing about me they should seriously be checking out psychiatry forums!)
But we LUUUUV you!! we even have an official "Broacher fan club" tatoo, see? *flashes open trenchcoat* Heck, some of the folks at About's GD forum wear theirs next to their "Corel Forever!" tats...the poor misguided fools.

:D;)

[SurfPark]

I think the discussion about the HOW forum is diverting a bit. We're not talking about free discussion boards, we're talking about the prices for their services. Their forums are just like every other forum on the internet...it has good and bad.

What I'm confused about is who their conferences are for. The pricing tells me they may not be designed for freelancers or in-house designers, which is a shame. The Adobe conferences don't seem to cost as much, but HOW and AIGA are expensive. $800+ per person (and that doesn't include travel costs or hotels) is steep. Could attending one of these conferences be used for networking which would lead to a job that would cover those costs in the long run? I guess, but I wouldn't hold my breath. I was told that the best places to network are where your profession is only represented in 30% of the groups membership. As designers, we'd have better luck networking at a business conference.

[budafist]

I was told that the best places to network are where your profession is only represented in 30% of the groups membership. As designers, we'd have better luck networking at a business conference.

Sounds about right to me. What use is networking with a bunch of other designers. We are all looking for work. Not desparately trying to give it away.

If you want to network, try going to small business expos.

[Seapony]

Here's the problem. Big venue + entertainment + A-list seminars/speaking engagement + swag + running the whole shindig + big end of conference party + everything else in between for 3 days = a heckuva lot of overhead. HOW is one big conference, it's expensive to host even under the most modest circumstances, plus pay all of the fees for the A-list who appear, the swag, entertainment and all the other goodies they offer. So that's why it's the most expensive. That's one reason why they say they'll likely never do NYC. Perhaps what they should try to do is maybe hold one every two years as AIGA does? Or perhaps just tone it all down so that everyone can afford it.

It's not a matter of who they're targetting based on their prices more than the fact that in trying to become the premier industry event they might of unintentionally "overdone it."

:)

[Kool]

It's too bad they don't do more of an expo floor as PD mentioned. That way they could let Adobe and Quark and Autodesk, etc. shoulder some of the costs and take the burden off of just the attendees. Personally a good expo floor would be more of a draw to me than the various speakers. The downside though is that they might end up becoming just another trade show.

[Broacher]

Well there was talk of doing a "Hotties of HOW" promotional calendar to defray the cost of the conference for attendees. But apparently some Canadian schmuck turned out to be a major holdout and the project got cancelled. Something about insisting on keeping his Maple Leaf thong on for the centre pages.

[cough]

[morea]

why wouldn't you ditch the thong, Broacher? ;)

[PrintDriver]

Big venue + entertainment + A-list seminars/speaking engagement + swag + running the whole shindig + big end of conference party + everything else in between for 3 days = a heckuva lot of overhead.
That's no different than any other conference for any other group.

It's not the pricing that tells you what the conferences are for. It's the seminars.

The How Design Conference offers educational seminars for designers. Isn't that tax deductable as a work educational expense?:D Ask your accountant.

[Seapony]

That's no different than any other conference for any other group.

It's not the pricing that tells you what the conferences are for. It's the seminars.

The How Design Conference offers educational seminars for designers. Isn't that tax deductable as a work educational expense?:D Ask your accountant.
One can only deduct so much (to their dismay :p).

HOW seems to pride itself on throwing a big conference that's chock full of goodies and entertainment, even transitioning to a big closing event party in the end. I'm told the huge themed bash was held at the Georgia Aquarium. I found a quick recap link (http://www.howconference.com/recap.asp). Perhaps in doing this they've begun to unwittingly shift their attention away from the "everyday designer's" budget? Or maybe it's a question of "Is the return worth the price?"

To compound things, I've heard some "regulars" at these events say they can easily end up spending on average $3,000.USD on sessions, meals, books and what is apparently a tradition among regulars, a pub crawl (and assorted non-event related revelry). Newbies foot the rounds. And that doesn't even include travel and whatever networking tidbits they might put together. Another reason why I've hesitated to go. Darned peer pressure.

;)

[PrintDriver]

Extra-curricular activities don't count. ;)

3500 attendees for a conference (according to Seapony's link) is in the medium range. 5000+ is large for a conference. Much over that and it approaches convention/event status.

Assuming the 3500 doesn't count exhibitors and staff, $3.5M plus whatever the sponsors throw in to host a conference? Even if I've slipped a decimal point (and I don't think I have), that ranks right up there in the scale of events.

But, HOW can charge whatever they want and if enough people go, they'll do it again next year. And the next. And the next.
Like you say, figure if the return is worth the cost before you go.

HOW could easily double their attendance by lowering the cost, possibly getting more sponsors in the process but adding twice the traffic problems and headaches. Perhaps the high ticket cost is their way of limiting attendance. Maybe it isn't so much keeping YOU out as keeping THEIR management issues down to a dull roar. :D

[milano.design]

Glad i checked in... I was just thinking about going to the AIGA conference in Colorado in October...that is $800 for the conference. cheaper than HOW. wow....

I went to a few HOW conferences back in the day. Early on when there were NOT 3500 attendees. The last one i went to was in 97? 98? in San Diego. Although i did find it fun to meet people that were "famous" the conferences really didn't "teach" me anything i didn't already know, instinctively.

My boss paid for the whole thing. And it was usually just a couple of designers that got to go every year. I'd say if you've never been its a good outlay of cash to go, but not every year. maybe every five?

This is why i'm interested in the AIGA conference, though, it seems to be on a more intellectual level than HOW... WHile HOW shows you the basics of business and design. I get the impression AIGA is a more theoretical approach. Just the paragraphs on who is speaking and their fields of expertise are higher up the rung...

anyone ever attend an AIGA conference?

but yes, i agree this is a huge outlay. By the time i actually get there and sit down its a $4000 outlay.... not to mention shutting down shop for 4-5 days... this is what has me still on the fence. (funny too there is a goat conference that same weekend in Colorado too -- so i would be able to attend both for the same flight /hotel costs)

[Seapony]

Extra-curricular activities don't count. ;)

You never know..."Pub Crawling" might be incorporated as a workshop next year. :D

HOW could easily double their attendance by lowering the cost, possibly getting more sponsors in the process but adding twice the traffic problems and headaches. Perhaps the high ticket cost is their way of limiting attendance. Maybe it isn't so much keeping YOU out as keeping THEIR management issues down to a dull roar. :D

Good point.

:)

[Jeff Fisher LogoMotives]

I'm currently not even going to take the time or energy to even try to defend HOW specifically - especially as a member of the HOW Magazine Editorial Board, the HOW Conference Advisory Council, a speaker at a HOW Conference for the fourth time this coming year, with HOW being the publisher of my books, and a regular participant on the HOW Forum.

When it comes right down to it conferences and seminars are expensive to coordinate, produce, promote and stage. The bigger the conference, the bigger the venue, the higher the cost to potential attendees. With all the various design, web and related industries holding such conferences the corporate sponsorships are stretched to the max as well. Yes, spending such a large amount of money just to go to a big conference in some destination city to party is expensive. However, the purpose of most is to improve oneself as a professional designer and businessperson while having some fun along the way.

Hey, I'd love to attend all the conferences and seminars that interest me - but for me, as a one-person business it always comes down to scheduling and budgeting. There a small design conference being held in Toronto in a few weeks. I'd love to go. Having attended before I know it is a very valuable experience - especially for my business. The registration was $800, then there would be airfare to Toronto, a hotel room would be additional, I'd probably want to eat while I was there, and then there would be additional expenses popping up left and right. In the end the decision was quite simple - I'd much rather spend two weeks in Italy next month for about the same amount of money. Maybe the conference in question will fit into next year's scheduling and budget.

You pick and choose what interests and works for you the most, and then plan for it. Bitching about it doesn't accomplish much of anything. However, as a member of the HOW Conference Advisory Council I will make the coordinators aware of the concerns expressed here.

A related comment: The bad-mouthing of other forums is always so professional. I ran across a design forum thread elsewhere making rude, snide comments about this forum and its members the other day. I just don't get it. What purpose does it serve except to make the individuals making the posts look like complete idiots? Again, you find the situations that work for you and not all of them will.

A few years ago a group of dissatisfied forum posters left yet another forum in a huff and set up what they thought was a private forum - where they proceeded to bad-mouth a number of individuals, including myself, and the manner in which things on the forum had been moderated and coordinated. Only one problem - their private forum was very public and it didn't take long for it to be accessed by all those about whom they were making rude comments. Prior to this incident I would have used the designers involved in the "secret forum" as resources for articles and books. Since then, I wouldn't be one to put "professional designer" in the same sentence with any of their names and have not made any contact with them to be sources for anything in recent years. (I may be able to forgive - but it is much more difficult for me to forget) I personally wouldn't want to be associated with such activities.

- J.

[Jeff Fisher LogoMotives]

Something about insisting on keeping his Maple Leaf thong on for the centre pages.

[cough]

Damn, I do so miss Thong Thursdays!

- J.

[Broacher]

Jeff, great response (as always). As far as I can tell, you are the Mother Theresa of the online design world (only with flashier underpants). And your comments about the childish practice of trashing other design forums is right on. HOW is (and was) a great online designer forum. Not everyone's cup of tea, but I'm thankful that there are other choices. As to the HOW conferences and their pricing--anybody who complains about the pricing of this and other like events will have a hard time convincing me of their complaints against the state of the industry. It costs money to raise a profession--most of that comes from the professionals themselves. Why should design be any different? And I think because HOW has made a lot of honest effort and taken the risk to be the first major trade mag to recognize the 'struggling masses' of lower rung designers (and in-housers) out there, it deserves everyone's support, not damnation. (In-housers example: HOW has been very supportive to In-source, the relatively new organization dedicated to raising the corporate designer profile and professional status).

Thong Thursdays? Ah, you can't go home again. Maybe we could start a 'Speedo Saturday' here, just once, for old times sake.

[Seapony]

Well sheesh, Jeff, I was hoping you'd finally chime in here and add some relevant insight. Thanks for joining in and sharing your perspective. :)

In the end it really doesn't matter to examine "why." There's no mistake that (the well put together) conventions are generally expensive—a venue like HOW's is certainly no exception. I can live with that tab.

However add to that the microcosm of convention regulars that have established traditions of camraderie that are becoming synonymous with the venue itself; traditions that one feels particularly compelled to participate in if one forms bonds by virtue of the forum exchanges, plus buying books, goodies, food, etc. and the potential expense simply skyrockets.

The Moral: It's expensive to expand one's continuing design education and be a social butterfly to boot.

;)

[morea]

A related comment: The bad-mouthing of other forums is always so professional. I ran across a design forum thread elsewhere making rude, snide comments about this forum and its members the other day. I just don't get it. What purpose does it serve except to make the individuals making the posts look like complete idiots? Again, you find the situations that work for you and not all of them will.

Just a friendly interjection - moderators here try to catch - and put a stop to - any threads that involve bashing other forums or other designers. that sort of behavior is not endorsed by GDF at all.

It looks to me like the only people who were discussing the HOW forums in this thread are actual members of HOW, and that the main concern voiced here was over the price of attendance for conventions.

HOW is certainly a respected part of our industry, and I can't even imagine the amount of work that goes into one of their conventions. I would love to be able to attend myself some day, but it's not currently within my means to do so. It sounds like a lot of other designers here struggle with that, too. I don't know if there IS a way for HOW to cut costs so that more designers could participate, but if they could figure something out, that would be wonderful. Thanks for voicing those concerns with the board.

As always, we certainly do appreciate you sharing your insights and experiences, Jeff.

[Jeff Fisher LogoMotives]

Well sheesh, Jeff, I was hoping you'd finally chime in here and add some relevant insight. Thanks for joining in and sharing your perspective. :)

I've been on my annual gold-mining vacation in Oregon's beautiful Wallowa Mountains. The best thing of all - no cell phone coverage or Internet access. It was also the first time I'd been away from my PowerBook in over two years!

- J.

[PrintDriver]

Disconnecting is great!
Try to do it at least once a year. Puts life in a whole new perspective.

Did you really go gold mining?

[SurfPark]

I think Jeff and PD hit the nail on the head. Its the size and the "fluff" that keep How's prices the way they are. I'd scale back the whole thing and do 2 or 3 smaller regional conferences. Even if money wasn't a concern for attendees, travel and dates are also issues. I find it ironic that How, a magazine that pushes accessibility via design, has morphed their conference into something so inaccessible. When price points starts to rival a European vacation, you have to wonder if things should change.

[Jeff Fisher LogoMotives]

Disconnecting is great!
Try to do it at least once a year. Puts life in a whole new perspective.

Did you really go gold mining?

Yep - have been doing it for about 10 years with a gaggle of friends. We do get gold each year - but we're not getting rich! It's much more about the disconnecting, spending time with close friends, eating incredible food and drinking great wines.

- J.

[morea]

Yep - have been doing it for about 10 years with a gaggle of friends. We do get gold each year - but we're not getting rich! It's much more about the disconnecting, spending time with close friends, eating incredible food and drinking great wines.

will pictures be forthcoming? :)

[Seapony]

I've been on my annual gold-mining vacation in Oregon's beautiful Wallowa Mountains. The best thing of all - no cell phone coverage or Internet access. It was also the first time I'd been away from my PowerBook in over two years!

- J.
Disconnecting is great!
Try to do it at least once a year. Puts life in a whole new perspective.

Did you really go gold mining?

What...you mean you guys don't go through any withdrawal symptoms? I don't think I can ever leave my precious for long...eveeeeeer.

:D

[Broacher]

I talked to a co-worker today who had just got back from her trip to the Grand Canyon-- someplace I had actually been to, even though it was 25 years ago!

But the thing that struck her (and me, as I still recall)-- given that she has a reputation for being a real (but likable) smartass, she was nonetheless bowled over by the impact of the sight, the place. Nature has a way of just absolutely shearing off all of a person's pretencious self-worth, and the sight of looking over that rim is about as powerful as it gets.

When I think about all the problems people have and just as often 'think' they have, I dream about what we could do with available 'humblizing' resources out there. There are certain natural sights that just about everyone should have a good chance to experience and share-- just to make you feel good about being so insignificant.

[budafist]

Wouldn't it be awesome to award a bunch of designers entry to things like that based on a design competition? The work can be displayed at the convention and people that REALLY want to go but do not have the means to do it can have a chance at it.

[Seapony]

Wouldn't it be awesome to award a bunch of designers entry to things like that based on a design competition? The work can be displayed at the convention and people that REALLY want to go but do not have the means to do it can have a chance at it.

The "Best of Show" winner for HOW's design competitions also (ordinarily) get an all expenses (accomodations, flight, conference) paid trip to their next convention, among other tidbits.

;)

[budafist]

Oh good. :)

[budafist]

....do they have to be US residents? I imagine a flight form New Zealand might be substantially more pricey!

[Seapony]

....do they have to be US residents? I imagine a flight form New Zealand might be substantially more pricey!

Hm, that's actually a good question. They do hold their International Design Awards competition after all...I imagine that Jeff would probably know.

:)

[Jeff Fisher LogoMotives]

Hm, that's actually a good question. They do hold their International Design Awards competition after all...I imagine that Jeff would probably know.

:)

Here's a list of who attended the 2007 conference (http://howconference.com/whos_attending.asp) - and there are quite a few from foreign countries. I don't know that there would be any limitations to the winning entry for the registration prize. I can find out if you like....

- J.

[DesignVHL]

I don't think HOW Discriminates contests by country like Computer Arts in the UK does....which figures because that is one of my fav. magazines. :)

[budafist]

I love Computer Arts too. Too bad the subscription my bf got me only lasted 6 months. I would read that sucker cover to cover.

[benjo]

I went to the 2006 Vegas How Conference. My previous employer paid for it. Like I said before it was a great experience. They are designers and the concerns they had seem to be universal throughout the design industry.

You don't go there to scout business by networking, no you go to sharpen your perspective and meet great designer like yourself. To me it was a great experience. And it made me feel like a designer again. I was totally burnt out when I went. I've been running of the kool-aid since.

Just as these forums can be used to draw inspiration and motivation to industry designers so can a great conference. And yeah there are pricy but we as professionals have to see value in things or how can we demand it for our "professional" work?

I highly respect my field of work and I think we overlook the value of certain things in our industry, which concerns me as to how do we ourselves view this field.

[PrintDriver]

Great post Benjo.
Good to see ya man!

[benjo]

Thanks PD. I try to swing threw when I can. But being on the forums all day isn't a good look if your trying to get promoted. LOL!