Cameras (digital)

[WR]

so,

i want to get my own camera now and i want a digital one. for some reason im scared of using a manual one and the thought of messing about with things and metering frightens me... so i want a digital camera.

having looking through magazines and catlogues, im still unsure on what i want. all i do know is that i want a decent camera to take shots. digital SLR maybe?

money wise, mum aint gona give me a penny for this 'thing' http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/emoticons/weep.gif which means i can only have X amount to spend. im thinking of spending NO MORE than £400 on this camera (around $750).

it would be nice if some of you more experienced fellows can steer me in the best direction and allow me to get my moneys worth! try keeping the amount to a minimum but the limit is what i've just mentioned above. of course, i'll get what i pay for but i'm not looking for something really proffesional and snappy here, just want something to take good pictures with that i can use in my projects and also make up collages to go in my portfolio.

any help would be much appreciated guys!

thanks once again!

p.s. i've been told to look for a Cannon

[Mickey]

I just bought the Cyber-shot Pro DSC-F828, it 8 mega pix and really sweet! It says $899 on the site but I got it for like $599 on-line, but the ony drawback to this model is that it doesn't come with any memory. so you have to buy it seporate. I have a 2gig high speed microdrive for it and it was like $299, but it holds like 290 some pics at full high res.

I love it.

www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DSCF828&Dept=dcc_DIDigitalCameras&CategoryName=dcc_DIDigitalCameras_CybershotProDigi talCameras (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DSCF828&Dept=dcc_DIDigitalCameras&CategoryName=dcc_DIDigitalCameras_CybershotProDigi talCameras)

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[TBdesign]

^great buy^
other around that price range are the canon digital rebel, and i cant think of some of the other ones right now. I will try and post them when i get a chance.
Grab a photography magazine and check them out in there you will get alot of reviews etc.

... Have no fear of perfection - You will never reach it ...

[D-Frag]

I have a sony F717 myself, its a great camera for a 5mp. I paid around $700 for it about 9 months ago, and it came with: wide angle lense, telephoto lense (titanium), 3 filters, a cleaning kit, shoulder bag, 32mb memory card, 64mb memory card, alumninum 4ft tripod, 4 hour battery w/charger.

Was one of the best investments ever, and to top it off, a nice tax write off!

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[1984]

I've got a digital rebel which is amazing, but with that you need to buy lenses, memory card/s, and whatever else..it's more of a pro-sumer camera. It does have a full auto mode, but to really unlock it's full potential, using the manual modes is best.
I also have a sony dsc-v1 which is nice for an all around camera. Some thing i look for in a point and shoot digital are: does it have a good rechargable battery, and removable media card.
For $750 you're bound to get something nice.
This site has some of the most in depth reviews I've seeen out there
http://www.dpreview.com/

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[beanz]

My personal opinion is don't go digital! I went digital about 4 years ago, spent £600 on a Fuji Finepix 6900z and can honestly say it was my worst buy ever... You won't get a Digital Rebel for £400 here, and that is about as low as i'd go spec wise on a digital.

I'm going to go back to 35mm as soon as i get some money together, and an entry level SLR will not only have all the auto settings of a digital, but will also take far superior shots! ;)

Well that's my 2c's anyway :P

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[1984]

Weapon, what is the end result of what you want to do with these images? There are loads of reason i can think of why you would want to stick with digital and only a few of why you might want film.

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[beanz]

If you're looking at spending £600, you're obviously wanting to take relatively serious photo's. If you're looking to print any as largish pieces a digital simply will not do it, at that price. Also you won't get any BULB features on a digital in that price range, so decent night photography is also out of the question.

The way i see it, for £600 you can have an expensive toy, or an entry level 35mm SLR with a couple of good lenses...

The other side of the coin is you'd have to pay for processing (which definitely addsd up), then when you scan the image into your PC (assuming you want to play with it a little) you'll have to spend a bit of time taking out all the scratches it got at the processor's, and the dust of course. And there's always the chore of finding a processor that doesn't mess up the exposures when developing, that's only happened to me once and i couldn't prove they'd done it unfortunately, so every shot was over exposed!?!


Like 1984 said... It really depends what sort of photography you want to do!

Forgive me if i sound a little jaded, but i've come to despise my digital camera! :P

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[1984]

I agree there, it's tough when you get into the area of trying to do certain things with a point and shoot digital and it just won't perform. Things like shutter release speed, lens changing, externall flash etc...
That's why the digital rebel is so good, it's pushed the cost of pro sumer cameras down and made it more accessable to people.
The one drawback is the size and bulk, i still keep my sony for traveling but use the rebel for 'artistic' shots.

Things i love about digital are the instant feedback of how the shot looks, It's made me a much better photographer, also with a large memory card, you can shoot indefinetly it seems like.

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[morea]

I have taken a FAR greater interest in photography since I've had access to a digital camera... and I've been able to achieve some great shots, too.

Before, if I really wanted a photo of a particular subject I would snap the shot and pray that it came out the way I wanted it to. Having to pay the cost of film and the cost for developing was very discouraging if a photo didn't come out just right. I actually gave it up for a few years.

When I got the digital camera it took some time to get used to it, but was thoroughly worth the effort. I really like the ability to preview the shot so I can be sure it's just what I want, and to be able to erase the pictures I don't like - instead of having to pay for them!

On the other hand, I understand that film-cameras can do things differently, and are better suited for certain situations. The 'zoom' feature, 'night setting', and shutter speed on the digi cam I have drive me crazy! But like anything, you get what you pay for.

if you can't say something nice, shut the hell up.

[1984]

I agree Moyra...it's helped me too

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[WR]

great help guys, thats a lot to process!

well all i want this camera is for taking shots that i can use in my projects if needs be. also, i've just bought my portfolio, some leather snazzy crap... and i was wondering if i could take some good shots of cars, scenes and subjects like an odd set of leaves or some wall cracks etc etc... and then collage them into some documnet, and print them out to go in my porfolio.

i got the idea when i saw this DB9 some dude just bought (flash car hmm)... and i thought i could take it out and grab some shots with it, make like a collage for print (brochure type thing with little text captions and what-not) and then print and mount in my portfolio... something fancy showing some design and photography skills maybe...

i hope you understand what im saying... lolz

whats a digital rebel? sooo, should i be looking at a digital SLR? be good if you can make a list... and yeah, i got this weeks Photography reveiw mag i think its called... told sister to pick it up for me - i'll have a read! i only want digital cos like 'cat-woman' says, you can view what your image will be before you even snap it... saving money and frustration at the lab when processing the film...

[1984]

I have no idea what you're really saying, but have you thought of becoming a high powered handgun owner?

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[WR]

http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/emoticons/violent.gif

gee, do i sound that stupid!?http://www.graphicdesignforum.com/emoticons/frusty.gif

[1984]

If you're taking pictures just to use for computer stuff...messin around, this that the other, then I don't think you need an SLR at all....

A digital slr or any slr for that matter gives you the option of fast shutter speeds, lens options, aperature, manual this and that...but lots of point and shoots now have some of these.

Seriosuly, check dpreview.com, they cover tons of cameras and do extreme in depth reviews.

A digital rebel is a canon camera, it's one of the least expensive digital slr's out there, but it's a really good camera at the same time.

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[WR]

right, i see what i said earlier looked like rubbish. to be honest, i dont just want to take pictures of this that the other, i do photography in school but miss out cos i dont bother going to the lessons, they're boring! lolz, going to start going from after half term break though that is why i want an SLR as i want to be become somewhat good with taking pictures. the differnet lens thing fascinates me... there is a lens where you can like take a shot of 180 degrees all around you right? somethng like that anyway... i want to learn about motion shooting and all that... so i thought getting and SLR and experimenting?

anyway, i'll check that site out, produce a list and then you guys can help me filter through down to 'a' camera.

[morea]

w00t! I can't wait!

if you can't say something nice, shut the hell up.

[beanz]

Sounds like a fish eye lens, not sure if they go to a full 180 degrees though, never really looked at em tbh!?! Would like to have a play with one though... :D

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[1984]

Yeah, a true fish eye goes 180, i'd say give the lessons a shot, there are a few main things to learn with an slr that you control, aperature (amount of light entering the lens) shutter speed, depth of field (how much distance is in focus) and little things like lenses, flashes and film speed.
Once you get shutter speed and aperature down, you can get real creative with them. For instance, aim your camera at a city street at night with the shutter left open for a good few seconds, you'll see an amazing effect. this you normally can't do with a point and shoot. If you wanna get artsy, learn an slr, it's worh it. I have a canon AE-1, they are an old standard workhorse for fim slr's..bare bones too...but you can get a good higher end slr for still a few hunder dollars.

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[MikeTheVike]

I was going to make a thread about cameras because I'm going to buy one soon. I'm going cheap though. I'm probably going to get the Canon A85, seems like a good bang for the buck. I have a lot of ideas for projects, and having a camera to take photos for the projects will help me tremendously.

[WR]

this isnt looking good, i've tried looking for some digital SLR's around £400 and there doesnt seem to be any on dealtime. theres quite a few for £500 like the D70 and Rebel but i dont really want to spend that much!

advise me guys!

[WR]

Fuji S7000 anyone?

[beanz]

I've not tried it, but i'm not a huge fan of Fuji's CCD technology (don't know if it's the same technology used by other brands, i would guess so!?!), when you zoom into the pixels it all looks very un-natural!?! This may have been improved though since my model, they don't even make it anymore...

I still advise film! :P

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[Wonder Woman]

I'm slightly biased, and I know you've already said no, but go with film. It's so much better than digital. I've just got me a slide & negative scanner and it rocks! I use an old school Nikon FM2-N with slide film and I've never been able to fault this method. I know you don't get the instant results as with digital, but after some practise, you'll be a much better photographer. Oh, and start going to class - you'll probably have missed heaps by now.

Apart from the stupidly expensive digital cameras (£3000+), I can tell the difference between a digital camera print and a film print, and the new fangled technology doesn't impress me.

I do have a digital camera, and use one all the time at work, but for my personal stuff, whether it's for photos to print or for my personal design stuff, I use film every time.

Try reading through this forum and asking there: www.thephotoforum.com (http://www.thephotoforum.com) since everyone there is a photographer.

Searching for creative juices

[beanz]

Wonder Woman said...
I've just got me a slide & negative scanner and it rocks!

I am so jealous! /emoticons/dry.gif That is my 'when i have a penny to my name' dream setup... /emoticons/worshippy.gif

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[1984]

WonderWoman, I'm still missing the idea of why film is so good...I mean everything done nowadays is in someways digitized at some point to be either printed or put on the web, so the way i see it is, why not save a step and just use a digital camera. And even if you do still use film, you have to have a good scanner to get it into the computer like you said. The only time i can ever see the need for film is when you're enlarging to a good size. but even that is usually just for artistic purposes.

I don't know, maybe i'm wrong but I really see the digital camera changing the worlld of photography for the better. No film to carry around, more pictures, no processing, I can adjust my ISO from 100 all the way to 3200!!, and who knows what else.

I'm not trying to be some rightous jerk, I just really don't get it when people say film is real or film is better...

Ordinary Life is Pretty Complex Stuff

[beanz]

Basically you just get a better picture for your money. If i was to buy a film SLR for £170, i would have to spend about £700/800 on a digital to rival it on picture quality. Okay if i wanted to make large high quality prints i'd have to spend another £800 on a decent slide scanner, but an £800 digital couldn't do it at all!

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[Wonder Woman]

I'm not disagreeing about the digital camera changing the world of photography, indeed I think it will, and to some extent it has. But, I feel, to get a photograph to a good quality, it's cheaper to go film still. To get ahold of a GOOD digital camera, that will print to a decent size and quality, you could get an entry level 35mm SLR and a scanner, plus a couple of lenses, albeit second hand (which most of my equipment is). This, to me, gives a greater range of flexibility and facilities than most similarly priced digital setups. Also, the accessories that you can get for a 35mm SLR are, I find, cheaper than that for digital, and the range is greater.

In about 5 years I think digital cameras will be in a place where I would hand over my SLR for a digital camera, but not at the moment.

Maybe I'm just old-fashioned, maybe I just haven't done enough research recently into changing over, or maybe I'm just ignorant. The set up I have at home (Nikon FM2-N, a range of lenses and a Minolta Scan Dual 4) produces images for print much better than the digital camera that we have here at work. To be fair, the camera and scanner probably cost a bit more than the camera we use here, but the quality more than makes up for this difference. Also, with digital on the increase, I'm finding second hand 35mm equipment coming down in price.

Searching for creative juices

[WR]

so i went into the shop today and had a hands on look at both the nikon d70 and the canon rebel. the canon feels lighter and smaller but which really is better. i know the nikon has a better shutter speed (fast - twice i think) and theres a slight different in pixels too but that wont make any difference which will be noticable anyway i've been told.

i still dont know which one to get! my heart tells me the canon cos of its lightweight and look but the nikon is a little bulky but looks of good build (wont break as easy)

HELP! i want to buy one soon!


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[beanz]

Just out of curiosity, as i'm lazy and can't be bothered to check it out... :P Which camera has the slowest shutter speed and the lowest aperture? This is very important if you plan on taking any arty night shots.

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[Allen Harkleroad]

I love my digital rebel. One reason is the lens interchange with my 35mm canon rebel even a 6.5mp the shots are beautifl. Looks as good as my 35mm cameras. Price is great too for a mid-level digital SLR. YOu can run on full AE or manual if you want to get artistic.



Allen Harkleroad
'I didn't do it... You didn't see me... You can't prove a thing...'

[PrintDriver]

Beanz, I'm with you on the film. But I am large format.
If any of you's with digicams plan on going larger than, oh, maybe, 8' x 10' at 300dpi you really need to go with the more expensive, higher megapixel cameras. And still they aren't good enough for really large format until you get into the digital scanbacks. With scanbacks you have image processing time issues yet. They are getting faster though. crazy expensive too.

Most of the photographers I use take larger chrome images. Not even 35mm but 2-1/4' or 4' color chromes. On rare occasions I have to hire a photographer that can take 8x10 color chromes. Scanning is then done by drum scanner. For high quality art prints, large format murals or even posters (or if you want any real sense of depth, imo) I'd stick with film.

Think about how hard it is to find usable large format images on the web. You pay extra for them too. And they take longer to get because they have to be scanned and sent on disk. It was easier just to rent a chrome for a week and do your own scanning. Ah, the good old days (just last year I might add) when you could get a photo or copychrome from a source and not have it be a printout or LVT of a 300dpi scan. That just SUX!

I just bought a Canon A85 to use for fun and 'approval/progress' shots. Not for production work. Nice little camera for the price. But it is little. As in if you have large hands you may find it very difficult to handle the small control features. I still have an Olympus 35mm film camera with a couple good lenses I use for still work.

PD is a grande format digital print dude. His advice/opinions may not apply to the 4color/offset/web world of printing

Post Edited (PD) : 2/27/2005 7:24:42 PM GMT

[Tyger]

this has been a very helpful thread, i'm really seriuosly thinking of getting the Rebel as it has dropped down in price $900CAD.
I'm also tempted to go get the Film camera version of the rebel and invest in a film scanner, but i have to do more research. I normally don't do things bigger than 8x10 but would still like the option of having negs to do drum scans if need be.

My hopes are to eventually take on photography seriuosly to add to my design skills so the ability to be able to do more than point and shoot is critical for my choice.

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[1984]

PD's totally right about enlarging and the problems of digital files, I buy discs from time to time from Getty and even then the biggest files are still small.

BUT, the way i see it is, unless your doing that all the time, a decent digital slr just cuts out the middle man, you go from camera to pc, no scanner involved.

I went to a camera store the other day and was holding the nikon and remembered also that it didn't fit in my hands ergonimcally...just one more reason for me.

you say potato...I say F@#& you!

[Tyger]

good point 1984, i am leaning towards the digital rebel, i like the size of it too, if i'm going to do some photography i want it to 'feel' like it. Can't get that effect from the smaller ones out there. I know it's not something to base your decision on but it's still my preference. I also went over to best buy and held the Rebel. It was a perfect fit. I guess buying it wouldn't be a bad time right now, but i keep hoping that it'll go down even more so in price.

For the majority of the time i'll be using it for some freelance work but fot the most part it'll be for personal use and a step to learning more in depth about photography. I like the fact with the rebel it can be a starters camera as well as intermediate.

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[1984]

No, it really is something to base a decision on, i mean when i take a picture i feel like i'm one with the camera, it has to feel 'weighty' in my hands, comfy and just right.
and from what i understand, digital cameras won't come crashing down to much more in price because ccd's which are the guts of a d-camera have reached an all time low.
Just hunt online for a deal, use www.cnet.com (http://www.cnet.com)

you say potato...I say F@#& you!

[WR]

I shall be saving up for the Canon EO3 300D (known as the Rebel in the States). So, who thinks I'm making the right choice? hehe

There's also the 350D coming out too. But still, I want the 300D.

1984, did you say you have one? I just want to know very quick what the battery life is like. I know it's good on the Nikon D70, but that really wont make me change my mind. I can just buy a few extra batteries for the Canon.


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[1984]

The battery life is noticably good, i have two batteries and it's a known fact that the aftermarket 'non canon' brand lasts longer, and it's true, maybe 25% longer...

Blah Blah. Pitter Patter.