All hiring managers need to read this

[reuber1]

http://www.icograda.org/web/feature-past-single.shtml?pfl=feature-single-2.param&op2.rf1=224

I couldn't have said it better myself.

updated link:
http://www.icograda.org/web/feature-past-single.shtml?pfl=feature-single-2.param&op2.rf1=224

"Nicotine, Valium, Vicodin, Marijuana, Ecstasy and Alcohol..."
"Nicotine, Valium, Vicodin, Marijuana, Ecstasy and Alcohol..."

[idaho]

In some case that's true but in my past experience hiring a junior is usually not all it's cracked up to be. Technologically they have been far superior to most of the older designers but they have also acted like spoiled primadonas who think their poo doesn't stink. They refuse to listen to the more experienced person, whether that person is right or not; the senior designer deserves some respect because they've paid their dues. They tend to have a 'I'm an artist! and above such trivial tasks as running a copier when the company is short handed' mentality.

For that reason I try not to hire people without 3-5 years of REAL WORLD experience. I just don't need the atttitude. If I wanted to deal with children I'd get my wife pregnant.

-Idaho
'You want it when? Ok, no problem. Excuse me while I pull the magic wand out of my ass!'

[St.Theresa]

Personally, as a somewhat inexperienced designer, I would jump at the opportunity to work with other, more experienced designers. I KNOW I have a lot to learn and am itching for the knowledge! Go ahead, put me in my place! Tell me I need to improve! Show me just how badly the POO stinks!! Let me know in no uncertain terms that I'm a newbie!! That's all I ask!!!

Just get me out from behind this receptionist's desk!

[Patrick Shannon]

Yeah, it's one thing to be asked every now and then to tend to a job outside the scope, however, too many designers are hired then not actually doing what they were told they'd be hired for. Back in college, the college referred one female designer to a job (who asked for a designer), but her job duties were mostly secretarial and little to nothing to do with design (or even prepress). The school phoned back and told them that they had a great group of graduate students from the administrative program, but not to request a designer when they didn't need one.

Patrick Shannon

'Dear valued customer, go home and die. Signed, your friendly graphic artist.'

http://www.patrickshannon.com/mwwc_sm.gif
My War With Culture (http://www.mywarwithculture.com)
Political incorrectness reinvented.

[idaho]

For the most part I agree with you Patrick, but I also believe that you do what the boss asks you to do whether it's within your design job's scope or not. If you don't like it , don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out (haven't we been down this discussion road before???).

Normally though, if I bring in someone to be a designer, that's what they are here for and what they are expected to do. HOWEVER, if we are short handed one day and design work can be pushed back a little, then I expect them to help out elsewhere in an emergency. It only happens about once every 6 months or so when we get that last minute rush job from a customer.

I just don't like getting attitude from the young guys and unfortunately I can't beat it out of them...but I can fire them. :)

-Idaho
'You want it when? Ok, no problem. Excuse me while I pull the magic wand out of my ass!'

[Patrick Shannon]

> but I also believe that you do what the boss asks you to do
> whether it's within your design job's scope or not

Well, thank god mein fuhrer has not asked me for a B.J. yet /DesktopModules/dotNetBB/emoticons/tongue.gif


> Normally though, if I bring in someone to be a designer,
> that's what they
> are here for and what they are expected to do. HOWEVER, if > we are short
> handed one day and design work can be pushed back a
> little, then I expect
> them to help out elsewhere in an emergency. It only
> happens about once
> every 6 months or so when we get that last minute rush job
> from a customer.

That's what I said, and to be honest, that's a great track record if you're only being asked to work outside the box every six months or so. Try every day. :)

But as far as the hiring process (like the case of my classmate), don't bother asking for a designer if you don't need one. Just ask for a secretary/gopher/etc, lots of people out there to choose from that'd happily do it.

Patrick Shannon

'Dear valued customer, go home and die. Signed, your friendly graphic artist.'

http://www.patrickshannon.com/mwwc_sm.gif
My War With Culture (http://www.mywarwithculture.com)
Political incorrectness reinvented.

[reuber1]

I only posted that to address the fact that HR managers could open up a bit (at least in my area; three rejection letterstoday in fact!)and at least send me an opportunity for an interview (I've had three interviews in the past 11 months)...personality traits and habits can be explored through references and, depending on how astute one might be, even during the interview. I am completely redoing my portfolio right now because A) my old one sucked and B) trying to compete with experienced designers is hard as hell. It's even more fun revamping a portfolio when you're working a sh!tty job over full time just to keep up with bills...


I totally agree with cocky newbies who failed to pay attention during Communication 101, who should be put in their place immediately. However, I think there are many of us who are undeserving of that preconceived notion...I take even my current job seriously, and many people have thought that I'm much older than I really am just because of the maturity that I upheld there. Of course, design work doesn't need to be delegated to designers like at where I work, just have the Cashier Team Lead do it and do a sh!tty job of it "Oh you're only a specialist, not a team lead, we can't have you designing the newsletter!" .


Idaho, I agree with what you say about the newguys, but with the "only hiring people with 3-5 years experience", if every art director or HR manager did that then a whole lot of us would be screwed...that's not very promising to those of us trying to get in the industry. It's gotten to the point where it seems you need to be lucky to get in this field.




"Nicotine, Valium, Vicodin, Marijuana, Ecstasy and Alcohol..."
"Nicotine, Valium, Vicodin, Marijuana, Ecstasy and Alcohol..."

Post Edited (reuber1) : 4/19/2005 12:22:13 AM GMT