Layering advice in InDesign

[alphabetic]

Hi everyone. I'm new here, so I apologise if my query has been forwarded before. I'm a graphic design BFA student, branching to computer use after first year of fundamentals etc (no computers). I'm designing a small interpretive publication, focussing on image, text and typographic expression. What I'd like to know is whether I create the typography (think experimental - like that in the 'Typographics' books) in Photoshop first, as well as the manipulation of images etc, before placing them in my InDesign layout? Sorry if this sounds insufficient for a proper response. I guess the look I'll be achieving is what you typically see in skateboarding magazines (ie. the layered look, grunge, manipulated photos etc). I don't see how you can produce this type of look directly in InDesign? Also, if I do have to create images FIRST in Photoshop, should I place EACH part separately in ID, or just flatten the images (typography etc) and then place in InDesign to set the type etc?

Sorry for my ignorance! But I'm so determined to get this right. I'd really appreciate any help/advice on this.

Cheers

[defjoe]

so yuo are making headlines I take it? Is this going to be like a brochure design or poster design (something with a few elements). If so I would do the headlines (type) you want in Illustrator. It's Vector as opposed to Raster, much cleaner for type. but it all depends what you want to do to it. there are fonts that have that grunge look but if yuo want to manipulate it... Illy is your best bet.

also save them as seperate elements and not one big one. File size will be huge that way.

[alphabetic]

Hi

The design will be a short publication and will appeal to younger readers, much like a skateboarding magazine would. When I said the look I'll be achieving is layered, I guess what I'm trying to see is that it will be utilise both utility and autonomy, much like Ray Gun magazine and similar. Those magazines have treated photos, expression typography, and experimental placement of text so I guess this is the gist of the question - whether I have to manipulate images etc in another program because I cannot do it directly in InDesign.

With regards to illustrator and creating the type, I don't see how you could produce grunge type (hand made) in that program (I scan in my type and treat it in photoshop).

[defjoe]

create paths in PS and export to Illy.

not saying yuo can't do it in PS... just have the resolution high enough so your get the crispness you need.

[keith1]

Here's what I do maybe I'm lazy though. Create the image for the page in photoshop, make sure you use 300dpi as you resolution, this is the recommended minimum for print. create all your grungy stuff, distressed heading/type, manipulated photos in this doc and leave an area blank if you want to add body copy in indesign. Then flatten it save as a tiff, import into indesign, add body copy and presto, done!

[keith1]

also if you want the ink to bleed of the page (print all the way to the edge) make the photoshop image about a 1/4" larger all around.

[alphabetic]

Thank you so much guys who responded. Anyone else with opinions/suggestions?

Thanks

[Broacher]

I'll offer this about flattening vs. keeping layers intact-- I wouldn't. If you're working in IDCS2, it has the option to import PSD layers as layers, allowing you to make adjustments right in ID after import. Or.... that's what the box says! (We haven't upgraded yet)

But even in earlier versions of ID, you can still import a layered PSD (or layered TIFF) and easily do post-placement tweaks by using 'Edit Image' in ID which opens the placed image in Photoshop. As soon as you flatten, you loose your opportunity to make further individual layer adjustments. The whole 'CS' philosophy Adobe UI is adopting is... hmmm.... sorta of what I would call the 'Just one of those things' approach. More fun, less commitment. (Not sure what it's doing for moral decay among designers.... but we were never exactly in a surplus situation there to begin with.)

If you work/save with layered TIFFs, one of the nice things about these is that they can also be placed directly into other, older apps that won't take PSDs-- such as PageMaker, earlier Quark versions, etc. Then you can still access the advantages of working with the non-commital layered approach by using the 'Edit Image' commands in these apps that boot the TIFF back into Pshop for tweaking.

[keith1]

I see your reasoning broacher however I always save a psd layered version and a flattened tiff so if i need to make changes i can revise the layered psd and flatten,save as, overite the last tiff. I got used to doing this using Quark 4 when I did mag layouts. it would be nice to do it directly in indesign though.