Who sends pdf's to their printer???

[rickself]

Sorry, y'all, but it's my time to rant.

I'd like to know who out there in this vast and crazy universe gave "designers" the AOK to hit one button to send a pdf file to their commercial printer? (I do know the difference between "designers" and Graphic Designers). You might as well be flippin burgers or washing cars.

PDF's are NOT the universal answer to getting a job through prepress.

I've been fighting with pdf's all week (actually forever), and it's only Wednesday. A new breed is upon us and they have the idea that you hit "Make PDF" and it converts all of your 72dpi rgb photos to a splendid work of art. Bleed? What's that?

PDF's are for sending files back and forth internally or for proofing. You need to know what you're doing in the layout stage.

Please TALK TO ME, your printers' prepressman. Save both you and me a big headache and pick up the phone.

I'm somewhat better now. Back to my pdf's.

Rick

[morea]

hmm, my printer requests that I submit all files in pdf format... but then, I do always ask ahead of time.

[Eraser Nubbin]

Me to morea, I have tried to have some places take an Illustrator file but they are adamate (Sp?) about having a PDF to print from.

[jimking]

rickself is right, he's being bombared left and right by great pdfs,(made deadline) alright
pdfs,(barely met deadine) and bad pdfs,(now nothing is making deadlines) including the great pdfs!!

[Patrick Shannon]

Well.....I have read articles about PDFs being the wave of the future, yada yada and it will/can make it possible for a printer that doesn't have my programs to be able to print something. On the other hand, if my printer didn't have/keep "somewhat" up to date with rudimentary programs I wouldn't want to work with them anyway.

[morea]

Please TALK TO ME, your printers' prepressman. Save both you and me a big headache and pick up the phone.

Failure to do just this can cause major hassles down the road. I always ask before sending any files. But then, I've worked in prepress too. ;)

[rickself]

Well.....I have read articles about PDFs being the wave of the future, yada yada and it will/can make it possible for a printer that doesn't have my programs to be able to print something. On the other hand, if my printer didn't have/keep "somewhat" up to date with rudimentary programs I wouldn't want to work with them anyway.
Right. If the printer isn't keeping up on software, they're gonna ask for a pdf because that's the only way they'll get your job to paper and ink.

But what I'm seeing so far in this thread is that you are all picking up the phone and talking to the prepressman/printer to see what they need.

If I ask the client if they made a ps file and ran it through Distiller, the reaction is going to tell me how much of a pain their job will be or how much of a joy their job will be.

I work 10 hrs a day minimum and I read what I feel is required to keep up to date on software issues. I respect the Designer that can send me a pdf and know what they were doing when they did it.

[woodwardo]

I send PDF's to printers all the time. I also send native AI files etc. upon request. I always make sure to ask what file they would prefer, sometimes PDF is great other times they want native file with fonts turned to outlines, and sometimes they want native with all art and fonts. When sending a PDf I always ask them for their distiller settings. Most have a preset that they can send you - others will send a little setup sheet. That way it's distilled the way they want it, and everyone seems to want it distilled a little differently.

[morea]

When sending a PDf I always ask them for their distiller settings. Most have a preset that they can send you - others will send a little setup sheet. That way it's distilled the way they want it, and everyone seems to want it distilled a little differently.

yup, me too. Makes everybody's life a little easier.

[MD]

I feel your pain Rick. I prefer to have native documents rather than pdfs because alot of our customers are brain dead. We print mostly spot color jobs and about 1/2 of the documents I get don't color separate correctly because they are created in CMYK or RGB. This leads to me having to call or e-mail to get a correct file - usually 2 or 3 times till they get it right. I would rather have all the source documents and make 3 minutes of changes rather than 20 min. of walking idiots through their problems.

[rickself]

I feel your pain Rick. I prefer to have native documents rather than pdfs because alot of our customers are brain dead. We print mostly spot color jobs and about 1/2 of the documents I get don't color separate correctly because they are created in CMYK or RGB. This leads to me having to call or e-mail to get a correct file - usually 2 or 3 times till they get it right. I would rather have all the source documents and make 3 minutes of changes rather than 20 min. of walking idiots through their problems.
BINGO_ON THE MARK!
A cd has 700megs on it and the client just burned a 2 meg file onto it. 4 color, lotsa photos...oh ya...bleed? "I ran the image all the way to edge. What else do you need?"
D'OH!!

[D-Zine]

I send 64 - 72 PDFs every week to the press we run with - at their request. I don't just click "make PDF" tho..LOL! I create postscript files and then distill them..one by one. Sounds like a pain and like it would take forever but its not, and it doesn't take long at all.

I had the prepress department send me their settings and I imported them into Distiller so that I would be set up as they needed. I never have any issues (well its VERY rare). I spend alot of time talking with the prepress department of the press we run with tho.

FORM A RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM! It's very important. I feel comfortable talking to them and vice versa - we built that respect right off the bat. I've said it a million times and I'll say it again...if they know you are trying your hardest to get the job right on your end - they'll pay extra attention to your job when it comes through. It's 100% true. These guys here are great. If they see something that they even think might not be right on one of my jobs, I get a call. They don't do that for everyone, and neither did I when I worked prepress :p

Opps I rambled again..but anyways..moral of the story is IF you are doing PDFs please speak with the prepress department and see how you need to go about it. Save the headaches and you will be glad you did!

[paulrandfan]

The printer we use at work has a special PDF format that I downloaded into InDesign, and that's how they want work submitted.

[woodwardo]

D-Zine
FORM A RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM! It's very important. I feel comfortable talking to them and vice versa - we built that respect right off the bat. I've said it a million times and I'll say it again...if they know you are trying your hardest to get the job right on your end - they'll pay extra attention to your job when it comes through. It's 100% true. These guys here are great.

Agree 100%.
Last time I was at one of my printers proofing - they had a question about one of the images being low res. (stupid client - all they sent) I went back and talked to the pre-press guy working with my file and ended up learning a bunch of printer geek stuff. Quite fun I tell ya.

[greyghost]

I do the same thing D-Zine does. Always have. And I get to know the folks at the print shop very well - and just as D-Zine said - they will call you if they have the slightest concern. They like you and know you (and vice versa), you made yourself an active participant and have made it clear you are not an idiot, nor do you think they are.

I'm on PC, so I also have to make EPS files from Quark and distill them, page by page, before sending them off to the printer. But I rarely, if ever, have a problem this way. I'm one of their easiest clients, and they tell me so.

[rickself]

FORM A RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM! It's very important. I feel comfortable talking to them and vice versa - we built that respect right off the bat. I've said it a million times and I'll say it again...if they know you are trying your hardest to get the job right on your end - they'll pay extra attention to your job when it comes through. It's 100% true. These guys here are great. If they see something that they even think might not be right on one of my jobs, I get a call. They don't do that for everyone, and neither did I when I worked prepress :p

Thanks to everyone. To know that someone truly cares, makes me warm and fuzzy all over. It's nice to be nice...gawd, now I feel like Misterrogers! :eek:

And YES, when you do call, if it's not the first thing I say, it will be said before I hang up..."Thanks for calling ahead and letting me know what's up and giving me the chance to let YOU know if the hard work you're putting into your file is worth your effort."

Remember, when you go out to your favorite restaurant, you may only see those people once or twice a month. But if you continually treat them like crap, pretty soon they're going start treating you the same or not serving you at all. Treat the right, you get the best service.

Thanks, again, all.:)

Rick

[D-Zine]

I'm one of their easiest clients, and they tell me so.

That's exactly what they tell me too, and I love it. One newspaper press we use to run with, about 6 years ago, let me output the film and everything myself too. I'm glad because it taught me a hella lot and I guess started my mission of preaching to other designers to form a good relationship with your printer.

Glad my advice was helpful guys, thanks! :)

[Robin Finnell]

One of my best friends' husband is a pressman who also does moonlight freelance design here and there.

I have to admit that I get far more web work than print work, and my friends live right next door, so all I have to do is walk over with a beer to get him to come over and "prepress proof" it for me. ;)

And my print house is his former employer, so I know it's how they want it and I haven't had a problem yet. *crosses fingers*

But yeah, most magazines these days (at least in my market niche - the horsey set) have requested PDFs. Only one ad got really *****ed up, and it was the pressman's fault for not proofing before going to mass print. Luckily, the magazine admitted it was their printer's fault and gave my client her money back as well as offering to reprint the ad in the next month's issue for free.

Live & learn... I had a HEART ATTACK when I saw the ad in the issue that was mailed to me... talk about potential "career ending faux pax!" :0

[ReedHendrix]

I'd been working on a ad to be submitted into a small local financial magazine, I rang the magazines printers to ask how they would want it sent and the conversation went like this:

Me: How would you like this file? PDF, AI etc
Printer: PDF?!?!?!?.... errrr not sure what that is..... just send it in a envelope!
Me (and everyone in the office): HahahHAhahaHAHAhahaha

I hope I never have to send anything for print there ever again.

[morea]

then there's the printer my boss insisted we use, who wants me to fax them my artwork.
*ugh*

[rickself]

We have a couple of client's that fax us jobs on a regular basis. You have to admit, fax machines have come a long way...

the quality is, well,

this is a copy of a fax and you can see how well things come across!!

Ain't technology great!

[D-Zine]

LMAO! Ok rick, you made me laugh twice today! You have reachedyer quota!! LOL

;)

[Rocketpig]

I used PDFs all the time to send to printers. But usually if the job is B&W. If it's color or might be a little tricky to print, I always ask if they would prefer the native file instead. Some printers want the native file, some want the PDF.

And complaining about 72dpi RGB images embedded isn't the PDFs fault, it's the retarded designer who inserted them.

PDFs are extremely useful if the designer knows what he/she is doing. Emailing a native file can be overly difficult if the printer isn't local, but often times a PDF works perfectly.

[Rocketpig]

Me: How would you like this file? PDF, AI etc
Printer: PDF?!?!?!?.... errrr not sure what that is..... just send it in a envelope!

You've got to be joking.

[rickself]

Thanks, D-Zine.
Laughter is good, 'specially when ya share!
How else are we gonna survive this trade?

[cjoe]

Me: How would you like this file? PDF, AI etc
Printer: PDF?!?!?!?.... errrr not sure what that is..... just send it in a envelope!
Me (and everyone in the office): HahahHAhahaHAHAhahaha


ahahahahahahahahahaha! exactly

[PrintDriver]

How bout the pdf where the art is floating in the page? Not only no bleed but far too much white space. Please don't use a 40" square artboard for an 8x10 piece.

We don't take pdf's at all. Well we do, but no promises on color in large format. If we can't tweek the file to fit the space time continuum the printing machine wants to be inhabiting at print time, anything can happen. Yes we can tweek pdfs if necessary. But we charge top desktop rate to do it.

[Vikia]

I send PDF's to printers all the time. ... When sending a PDf I always ask them for their distiller settings. Most have a preset that they can send you - others will send a little setup sheet. That way it's distilled the way they want it, and everyone seems to want it distilled a little differently.
This is my MO as well. I just ask for their settings. Never seems to be a problem. If they prefer native over PDF I give them native files.

[expressgraphics]

I used to work with a certain university that would send in PDFs and all of their artwork would be low res. RGB images, the documents were created in an old version of Pagemaker and they would have Kinko's make the PDFs. All the way around they didn't know the they were doing, and naturally they would want copy edits or pages re-worked. So yeah I feel your pain.

[Allen Harkleroad]

I always call the printer if I haven't worked with them before, once i have their specs on pieces I keep a file on them. I gnerally send PDF, but it is outputted properly or like someone above said I send a AI file with the fonts converted to outlines so they don't have to muck around with fonts.

Allen

[cjoe]

i know places where they insist you send them PDF's, but they also provide you with (Australian) standardised distillation settings, i'm not sure if that is widespread practice in the states?

[Vikia]

Me: How would you like this file? PDF, AI etc
Printer: PDF?!?!?!?.... errrr not sure what that is..... just send it in a envelope!
Me (and everyone in the office): HahahHAhahaHAHAhahaha

bet you weren't talking to the prepress dept...more likely the sales rep who sold the ad.

[D-Zine]

Vikia - that ^^ is what I was thinking. The salesppl I work with dunno what a PDF is and they think FTP is a file type...lmao :/