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  • MichaelWied
    Reply to Company Logo Rebranding Critique
    MichaelWied
    Sorry, but the tags scream "I don't have an original thought" no matter what orientation they're in. I can understand trying to use them if someone is just totally concentrated on the logo and...
    Today, 04:07 AM
  • ISitude
    Reply to What is this product ? please
    ISitude
    Whipped cream.
    Today, 03:17 AM
  • LumLum1013
    Feedback for my personal logo
    LumLum1013
    I'm in the process of a major personal portfolio overhaul, going back to the basics and revisiting my logo and identity.

    Most of my graphic design work is on the corporate side, so definitely
    ...
    Today, 02:59 AM
  • mikeengland
    Reply to Have you met ...me
    mikeengland
    I haven't interned, but I have done a nice chunk of freelancing. Also while viewing other users I checked out the rules. I have applied at a few places, but so far I have had only one interview. It went...
    Today, 01:35 AM
  • Buda
    Reply to Have you met ...me
    Buda
    Hi Mike and welcome to GDF.

    We ask every new member to read the threads posted HERE, particularly this thread to get acquainted with how things work on GDF. They will explain how the...
    Today, 01:23 AM
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  • 30 days, still not paid

    In October, I did some work for a client that I've worked with for many years. The relationship is casual, and I enjoy her as a person quite a bit, but today. Ugh. I'm just filled with disappointment.

    Upon her request, I revamped her website. It wasn't the biggest project on the planet, but it was a $1k or so when all was said and done. In preparing for the holiday season, of course it was "rush rush rush" -- I must have received 20 emails a day if I received one with, "One more thing ..." requests. Which I honored. And by working a couple of late nights, I got it all done and right on time. (She gave me a firm deadline.)

    Then I sent the bill.

    And well, it just sort of sucked because the response I got was, "Can I have 30 days, please please please ... cash flow is tight right now because sales are low." Which really isn't my problem the way I look at it. And it isn't how I roll. I always require a deposit before I do work, but with her -- it just looked like $100 worth of quick web updates in the initial ... but she's scattered and unorganized and "one more thing one more thing" and pretty soon it was a HUGE task.

    The topper? She was leaving for a three week European vacation the following day. She knew I knew this, so she gave some excuse about how her husband was financing the trip -- what. ever. (The year before she was late on her bill, but then introduced me to her new expensive pure breed puppy that she flew to the east coast to pick up just that month.)

    And so ok. I can handle it, I've had to work around bigger problems with bigger bills that weren't paid on time. But not really. I mean. That's my paycheck. I have bills to pay.

    It's been over 30 days and I haven't heard from her. I know this is oh so tacky to discuss money, it always makes me feel uncomfortable, but dammit! I am putting Christmas presents on my credit cards and working double time to make up for having to play BANK for a client. I turned down other jobs so I could take care of her. Other PAYING jobs.

    I shouldn't be thinking of how I am going to work around not having that money, I just shouldn't. It's not fair. I've never once done this to anybody I've hired, and I would never.

    Anyway. I hate complaining about this stuff, I really do. I am a positive person, or I try to be. But sometimes people just anger me. *growl*

    I know she'll honor the bill ... eventually. Maybe when holiday sales pick up. But I know one thing, I'll have to bug her endlessly to get it. I always do.

    Over the years I've gotten much better about how I handle my business, this doesn't happen to me anymore because I am meticulous about contracts and consideration. But she's a ghost from the past, and even though I've explained all of this and even tried to refer her to somebody else, she refuses to go to another designer and will bug bug bug me until I do the work.

    I wrote her a response over 30 days ago and told her exactly how this affects me, no response to that.

    It's just really disappointing that people will knowingly hire you, crank on pressure and ask you to do this work for them KNOWING they have no money to pay the bill. And what sort of hurts is that we have this long-term relationship and she knows that I go the extra mile for her.

    What is up with that?

    It makes me feel like a sucker, but I refuse to blame myself (which I always do). I just needed to get this off my chest is all.

    *deep breath*

    Thank you for listening.
    You can fool some of the people all the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on. --GWB

  • #2
    people. Grr! Whether intentionally or not, many are very selfish. It's sad, really.

    I hope that this works out for you. After 30 days you could start charging late fees and interest and send a new bill next month... not that it does you any good at the moment.
    "It's never too late to be who you might have been." - George Eliot

    Comment


    • #3
      Yeah. I do need to look into the interest thing, but there are VERY FEW people that I bill this way. Usually it's by project -- deposit, incremental, final payment.

      I was thinking that I might do a retainer situation with her in the future, because if she doesn't have it in the bank, and if she can't pay by credit card, then she shouldn't be buying it. That's the thing! I could not imagine hiring you morea, for that much work, and then saying "Can I have a month to find money?"

      I know she's not a bad person. We have had run ins in the past about money, and one large bill I wound up just letting go because it wasn't worth fighting over. And she brought over an INCREDIBLY EXPENSIVE piece of art as a peace offering. She and I have had many talks about how hard it is to be self employed, she is herself, I know she knows what she's doing to me.

      But you know I'm thinking. Do I even bother continuing the relationship? I mean I know I'll get the money, but I am not sure I want this frustration.
      You can fool some of the people all the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on. --GWB

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by EC
        I could not imagine hiring you morea, for that much work, and then saying "Can I have a month to find money?"
        Well, that's good, because I would take out your knees with a bat if you did that.

        "It's never too late to be who you might have been." - George Eliot

        Comment


        • #5
          LOL. Well, I'm just trying to put myself in the shoes of somebody that would actually do that. You know what I mean? I'm trying to decide if it's a character thing, and if I should discontinue this relationship. It's not all about the money.
          You can fool some of the people all the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on. --GWB

          Comment


          • #6
            I have had this happen before. Although I do not design websites mainly logos and illustrations and alot of turning 96 dpi jpegs into vector art (hey it's boring but pays the bills). I send my customers proofs of their logos etc. in a format that is impossible for them to use for anything other than picking up dog crap until I am paid in full I don't care how nice they are, how much business they have given me or whatever their sob story is, when I get paid they get the art no exceptions ever. Yes I have lost some business because of this but I no longer get ripped off. Just last night a new client I was finalizing a logo for after numerous changes and phone calls, she was the nicest woman and I hated to tell her no when she asked if she could mail a check and in the meantime get her art. I simply told her although I am sure she is honest and would send the check It was my policy not to do this no matter what and the only way she could get her art immediately was to pay the invoice i emailed her with a credit card. I was very professional in explaining it and she understood and actually complimented me for sticking to my guns.
            How about a chain pickerel in your bath tub?

            Comment


            • #7
              I was just teasing of course. I know what you mean. I couldn't do that to someone, especially around the holidays.

              imo, the way you treat others says an awful lot about your character.
              "It's never too late to be who you might have been." - George Eliot

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Logo-Mechanix
                I have had this happen before. Although I do not design websites mainly logos and illustrations and alot of turning 96 dpi jpegs into vector art (hey it's boring but pays the bills). I send my customers proofs of their logos etc. in a format that is impossible for them to use for anything other than picking up dog crap until I am paid in full I don't care how nice they are, how much business they have given me or whatever their sob story is, when I get paid they get the art no exceptions ever. Yes I have lost some business because of this but I no longer get ripped off. Just last night a new client I was finalizing a logo for after numerous changes and phone calls, she was the nicest woman and I hated to tell her no when she asked if she could mail a check and in the meantime get her art. I simply told her although I am sure she is honest and would send the check It was my policy not to do this no matter what and the only way she could get her art immediately was to pay the invoice i emailed her with a credit card. I was very professional in explaining it and she understood and actually complimented me for sticking to my guns.
                I am truly going to have to start doing this. I'm going to try to take a week at the end of the year and do some planning for 06 -- one of the issues I have to sort out is, how do I handle clients that have been with me since my early days, the days when I was much less careful with such things. How do I undo the damage I've done with them by letting them take advantage and change their expectations.

                Things to ponder.
                You can fool some of the people all the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on. --GWB

                Comment


                • #9
                  Lay down the law right from the start, your clients will respect you and the ones that don't like it are probobly the ones you would have trouble collecting from if at all anyway.
                  How about a chain pickerel in your bath tub?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Right. And I do that. My current clients are amazing, and I am incredibly strict about "the formalities" -- but, I had to learn how to conduct myself the hard way, by making mistakes. What I'm talking about are people that in the past, I've allowed to take advantage. No wonder they won't go to another designer.
                    You can fool some of the people all the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on. --GWB

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      We all had to learn the hard way and I am sure other people here will tell you that as well so you are not alone in this regard. When you lay down the law with long time clients you may loose a few but you loose the headaches along with them. Initially you may loose a few bucks and maybe a client or 2 but I am sure these people didn't just stay with you because they could take advantage of you. You must be doing a good job because crap for free is still crap.
                      How about a chain pickerel in your bath tub?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I had the same problem with a print broker client of mine. At first it was all good, she asked for 30 days and paid on time for a few months. Then all of a sudden she forgot to pay ... I let it slide and then another month went by with no check and now she owed for even more work that I did. So I let a few rush jobs pile up and then I put her account on hold until she was paid up completely. Amazingly she came up with most of the money within the week. Of course this no payment behavior continued and at one point she owed me more than $2200. I eventually had to stop doing work for her because I hate having to beg for money that is owed to me.
                        Some advice is profound, some is clever. The above post is a good example of both.
                        http://www.pedrospracticaljokes.blogspot.com/

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          If mean people suck, deadbeats swallow.
                          How about a chain pickerel in your bath tub?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I mean, after all the time I've just spent complaining about this on the GDF -- where will I find the time to beg for money? lol

                            Honestly -- it's the worst having to beg for money. I really really hate it. A lot.

                            I am fine with losing old clients, in fact I've tried getting rid of a few people that INSIST on coming back to haunt me. This whole week has been filled with them, and they refuse to listen.

                            MD -- one time I had an arrangement with a publisher who refused to work on my terms, I was flexible -- we worked out weekly payment installments. Weeks went by and she manipulated me to no end until finally I stopped the work. That's when sh*t hit the fan. I thought she would find money, but instead she stopped taking my calls and hired another designer. I heard months later that this new gal never got paid, nor the printer. People suck.
                            You can fool some of the people all the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on. --GWB

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I once worked full time for a small printer and the first time he bounced a payroll check and made up some lame excuse I bought it. When it happened the second time I didn't show up for work the following monday. When he called to find out what happened to me I told I wasn't coming in until the check cleared and if this happened again he would be dealing with labor board and one less employee. He said what am going to do I have thing that have to get done today I need you here I told him I will come in but only if give my check in cash plus the bounced check fee.
                              How about a chain pickerel in your bath tub?

                              Comment

                               
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