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  • need creep advise...

    I'm designing a 72 page (including cover spread) booklet in ID CS. It's 18, 11X17 spreads that fold down to 8.5X11 with saddle stitching on the spine. I set up the file as 8.5X11 facing pages with .5" margins all around. This will be run on a Xerox DocuTech on 70lb text, with the cover color copied on CC Gloss cover. How much should I allow for creep? Will InDesign's Package command automatically adjust for this? I know the book will have to be back-trimmed because of the number of pages, but I don't want everything to be all hunky-dorey until the trim cuts off half the page numbers. Usually, I let the printer take care of creep, but I obviously can't do that this time.

    Any ideas?

    -jason

  • #2
    doesn't anyone know anything about creep? I really don't want to go into this flying blind.

    Comment


    • #3
      I had the same problem with this in Quark. Never really got an answer for it, got lucky and ended up binding the thing so it became a non-issue.
      Sorry but I am no help here.
      match in the gas tank, boom boom

      Comment


      • #4
        We work out of Corel and we also have this problem. We take the amount of paper per book and fold it as you would the book. Then we measure the amount from first page to middle page and divide that by the number of sheets you used to fold. That will give you a good estimate of the increments that you need to take each page down. Hope this helps.
        Go ahead and feed the animals...

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        • #5
          Also, if you have any bleeds then you are going to have to manipulate that if your bleed fall towards the center of your book to insure proper margins.
          Go ahead and feed the animals...

          Comment


          • #6
            Not sure if Indesign has a creep feature because we use a workflow system where we plug in the figures and it does all the work. The way to get the figures--72pg 70# (matte text) divided in half measures .144. The tricky part comes when dividing this figure. Your low and high folio pages would stay at 0 and then creep to a maximum of .144 to the center of your book. Cover needs no creep.
            WYSIWYG

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            • #7
              thanks for the helpful words, guys. There's no bleed anywhere, and my margins seem to be wide enough to prevent any highly noticable differences, as long as I put my page numbers at bottom center. I guess I could just have them run one out and back-trim it for me to take the customer.

              Thanks again!

              Comment


              • #8
                One more input:
                Preps has this equation:
                Total # of pages / 4 * paper thickness.
                English now:
                Total pages divided by 4 multiply by the paper thickness.

                I'm not sure if Preps than takes this number and uses it in its' own calculations or not.
                People tell me "Have a Good One!' Hell, I already have a good one, I just need a BIGGER one! - George Carlin

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                • #9
                  Hey Rick, check out this website, it has a handy tool called "Spine Calculator"
                  It calculates spines plus thickness of specified papers which then you can use for creep.

                  http://home.comcast.net/~jeff.ulicny...are/utils.html
                  WYSIWYG

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                  • #10
                    Thanks, Jim. I downloaded and will give it a look-see.
                    People tell me "Have a Good One!' Hell, I already have a good one, I just need a BIGGER one! - George Carlin

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                    • #11
                      >>doesn't anyone know anything about creep?<<

                      We had this guy in our neighbourhood who was always hanging outisde the fence to the local swimming pool. The police seemed to know what to do with him.

                      But prepress creeps? (I know some of those too...)

                      My first move would be to talk to your printer. It's highly likely that they will tell you exactly what to expect for the number of pages and the stock that you've chosen, what the safety margins are to design and accomodate the creep. Also, they're just as likely to tell you that there imposition software will make the adjustments for this.

                      Just for curiosity sakes, old PageMaker had creep and bottle controls in its ancient booklet maker plugin. Of course, there are good third-party imposition plugins for ID that have that, and more-- Imposer Pro is what we use.

                      Then there are Acrobat plugins, like QuiteImposing that can handle this task as well.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks for all the help guys. It turned out to be no big deal. My .5" margins were plenty, and the book didn't look too mangled with the back-trimming. I usually worry for no reason.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jimking
                          Not sure if Indesign has a creep feature because we use a workflow system where we plug in the figures and it does all the work. The way to get the figures--72pg 70# (matte text) divided in half measures .144. The tricky part comes when dividing this figure. Your low and high folio pages would stay at 0 and then creep to a maximum of .144 to the center of your book. Cover needs no creep.
                          Lets do it again--72pg 70# matte text / by 2= 36 spreads at .144 thickness / by 36= .004 . Starting from the center spread (front and back, pg35-38) move your pages in towards the spine by .144. Next spread underneath -.004 from .144=.14, move the second spread in .14. 3rd spread same thing--.14-.004=.136-.004=.132-.004-.125-.004=.124-.004=.12-.004=.116-.004=
                          .112-.004=.108-.004=.104-.004=.1-.004=.096-.004=.092-.004=.088-.004=.084-.004=
                          .08-.004=.076-.004=.072-.004=.068-.004=.064-.004=.06-.004=.056-.004=.052-.004=
                          .048-.004=.044-.004=.04-.004=.036-.004=.032-.004=
                          .028-.004=.024-.004=.02-.004=.016-.004=.012-.004=.008-.004=.004...This is why printers always took care of this.
                          Last edited by Kool; 09-21-2005, 02:40 PM. Reason: Needed a couple hard returns so it didn't make me scroll
                          WYSIWYG

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            If you are having this printed - I would talk to the printer who is doing the printing, how they think you should set up your file. They may have their own creep set ups that they use and may want you not to do anything to your file. I would mention that your page size is 17 x 11 - this might be a problem depending on how they apply creep to their jobs.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Actually, this is being "printed" on a Xerox DocuTech. We will use our bookletmaker to fold & saddle stitch, and probably do the back-trim by hand on our pneumatic cutter. The bookletmaker supposedly backtrims, but doesn't do a great job on booklets of this size.

                              jimking - sheesh!

                              Comment

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