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  • #16
    Very good morea. Logo design SHOULD go this way. I try to explain vector all the time and how it is necessary for all these reasons you mentioned. Simple is better and for it to work in B&W but, a lot of clients want so much more and if you can't do it there are a ton of designers and beginners that will. Like the client that wants a really cool 3D logo with lots of gradients and shine, etc. or a full illustration for a logo. Try to tell those clients what they really need. If it is just for web use and not for print it is a different story.

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    • #17
      It's tricky to balance what we know will work across the board in a logo vs what a client wants - I usually tell my clients why we do logos that way, and adapt what they want to the basics.

      But if they're insistent on one thing I'll do it. I mean that's why they hire me, no?

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      • #18
        Great writeup for designing! I really enjoyed and grabbed new information for graphics design aka logo design.

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        • #19
          I am a great believer in ensuring a logo is designed so as to look good in B&W - This article however gives an interesting viewpoint...
          Is it time to retire the black and white logo?


          http://noisydecentgraphics.typepad.c...-logotype.html
          Never trust someone, who, if left alone in a room with a tea cosy, doesnt try it on..

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Jahbuzzz View Post
            I am a great believer in ensuring a logo is designed so as to look good in B&W - This article however gives an interesting viewpoint...
            Is it time to retire the black and white logo?


            http://noisydecentgraphics.typepad.c...-logotype.html
            Whoever wrote that article obviously has never worked for a printer. I can name at least a dozen times in the last month alone where we produced a client's logo in one color.

            That author also makes the mistake in assuming "black and white" literally means black ink on white paper (I hate the term black and white simply because of this). What about frosted on glass? Embossed in leather? Etched in wood? Routed from metal? Engraved in plexiglass? These are all instances where a multi-colored logo just won't work and needs to be functional as one color.

            He also uses the Google logo as an example of not needing a b+w logo but even Google is finding it increasingly hard to keep their logo with multiple colors.
            Last edited by Sketcher; 01-04-2013, 05:55 PM.
            "Design is not just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
            -Steve Jobs

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Sketcher View Post
              Whoever wrote that article obviously has never worked for a printer. I can name at least a dozen times in the last month alone where we produced a client's logo in one color.

              That author also makes the mistake in assuming "black and white" literally means black ink on white paper (I hate the term black and white simply because of this). What about frosted on glass? Embossed in leather? Etched in wood? Routed from metal? Engraved in plexiglass? These are all instances where a multi-colored logo just won't work and needs to be functional as one color.

              He also uses the Google logo as an example of not needing a b+w logo but even Google is finding it increasingly hard to keep their logo [url=http://www.androidapplabs.com/wp-content/themes/androidtech/images/Droid%20Screen%20Capture/nexus-one/BACK_rgb.jpeg[/url]
              *applauds*
              "When you have to kill a man, it costs nothing to be polite." --Winston Churchill

              Call me Ares.

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              • #22
                Very true Sketcher!
                Never trust someone, who, if left alone in a room with a tea cosy, doesnt try it on..

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                • #23
                  My view on this whole thing differs some from most of the opinions expressed on this forum. I'm probably more in line with the arguments made in the article, but I don't think it's time to "retire" B&W or grayscale logos. Instead, I'd just relegate them to secondary importance and consideration.

                  My opinion is that a logo needs to be custom tailored, first, for its primary intended use.

                  I can't see good sense in starting with the limitations of black and white if the logo in question is hardly ever going to be rendered in black and white. I say this fully acknowledging that at some point down the road that very logo might need to be applied to the side of a pen or embroidered on a ball cap or run through a fax machine. Those subsequent and secondary applications certainly need to be considered and contingency versions of the logo need to be created. But for most uses in today's word, I'd much rather design a killer color logo that looks OK in B&W than I would a killer B&W logo that is less than what it could be in color. And you know, I've found that most clients seem to agree with that logic when the benefits and drawbacks are explained to them.

                  In other words, I reverse the usual rule of starting with B&W before considering color. Instead, I'll often start with color, then work backwards to B&W. Yeah, I know this is heresy, but it's not the 1980s any longer and every logo doesn't need to look as though it rolled of a spot color letterpress in Basel, Switzerland.

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                  • #24
                    I'm very ambivalent on this as well. I'll design a logo that'll look good in color and b&w, but the b&w versions never get used.

                    To knock out one of the most essential design elements: color, is sort of stupid in my book, as it is the one that most strongly influences the emotions.

                    I have small businesses as my major clients. I ask them if this is going to be embroidered, embossed or sandblasted in a door and they laugh.

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                    • #25
                      The article's points against b&w could be used a case to use b&w. If everything's colour, nothing's colour. B&w will make you stand out. And monochrome lives by the same principles as b&w, like the Tate example - it's a one colour job.

                      He doesn't really use good examples of logos that are used across all different media but rely heavily on shading and effects for impact, and lose impact when rendered simply. The Melbourne logo always comes to mind.

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                      • #26
                        Roth has a point that the monochrome logo, if strong, can still be stronger in color.

                        But please NEVER assume that a black and white simple version may never be used. I have more instances than fingers just this past year where we've had to take a gradient-only, or worse, totally raster logo and "Make IT WORK" in one color vector in order to produce etch vinyl for glass, or stenciling, or etch and fill in wood or metal. Just because you don't know a production process is out there, doesn't mean it isn't.

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                        • #27
                          Agreed - it's got to work in B&W, I design w a pencil, so I start in black and white, then work it up in color and b&w.
                          But being a painter first I always use color - there is just too much that can be said w color to throw it out.
                          And yes, I did the glass etch thing for the winefest, you never know when it'll come up.

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                          • #28
                            Sorry but I can't see the logo example that the original poster is referring to, can anyone help me out here?

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                            • #29
                              I think it's just as important – probably more so – for a logo to work reversed out, i.e. white reversed out of a coloured or black background, rather than simply a black and white version of a logo.

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                              • #30
                                I understand with creating a logo purely as a vectorized element is the absolutely best way of creating a logo, for obvious reasons such as scaleability to name the least, but my question is this. What are your thoughts on integrating both photoshop and illustrator together with the introduction and better support of smart objects? Using photoshop to add effects or realistic feels to once flat and verctorized looking branding, of course when it is most appropriate. Or do you all feel a nice vectorized branding is the way to go? Or how and if so Are there more appropriate ways of achieving these more realistic looking brandings which are more popular today without the use of photoshop?

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