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  • Editing Multiple-page PDF's in CorelDraw

    If I open a 4-page PDF in CorelDraw, I can edit anything in it. But if I save my changes, it saves as a 4-page cdr file. But I want to save the changes to the PDF. Is the only way to save the changes to the pdf file to re-publish the whole 4 pages to PDF again and have it replace the old one when asked? Wouldn't this further compress any jpgs? Re-publishing the whole thing and changing the settings to no compression (and remembering to reset them back again later!) seems very inefficient......The question, of course applies to single page pdf's as well, but I'm thinking of eg deleting or adding a page or changing page order.

    Janet

  • #2
    Originally posted by janetb View Post
    If I open a 4-page PDF in CorelDraw, I can edit anything in it.Janet
    Not really true. Trust me. So much depends on what's in and how that PDF was created. Draw (or for that matter, Adobe Illustrator) can 'open' most PDFs, but that doesn't necessarily mean what you get after opening is identical to what you have in the PDF. For instance, spot coloured objects, live transparency, embedded fonts, color spaces/profiles, overprints... Nor is a PDF opened this way as editable as the source file it came from. Often things as simple as a gradient can be really difficult to work with.

    Originally posted by janetb View Post
    But I want to save the changes to the PDF. Is the only way to save the changes to the pdf file to re-publish the whole 4 pages to PDF again and have it replace the old one when asked?
    Yes -- well, either republish to PDF or export to a PS file and use Adobe Distiller (or even 'print' to a PDF file). But you see, the workflow is intentionally set up this way to prevent users from doing what you're trying to do, because as a production practice, it's wrong. Source files are for editing, PDFs are for handing off. Sure, sometimes it's impossible to escape the process of opening a PDF to edit, but you have to really be aware of what can and could go wrong.

    Originally posted by janetb View Post
    Wouldn't this further compress any jpgs? Re-publishing the whole thing and changing the settings to no compression (and remembering to reset them back again later!) seems very inefficient......The question, of course applies to single page pdf's as well, but I'm thinking of eg deleting or adding a page or changing page order.
    And there you go: I can see that your'e thinking about what can go wrong! If you're just after page deleting/addition/order -- all that is easily done from directly within Acrobat Pro-- without any risk of page content errors.

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    • #3
      At least she's aware of what can potentially go wrong. Most people just do it anyway.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Bob View Post
        Not really true. Trust me. So much depends on what's in and how that PDF was created. Draw (or for that matter, Adobe Illustrator) can 'open' most PDFs, but that doesn't necessarily mean what you get after opening is identical to what you have in the PDF. For instance, spot coloured objects, live transparency, embedded fonts, color spaces/profiles, overprints... Nor is a PDF opened this way as editable as the source file it came from. Often things as simple as a gradient can be really difficult to work with..
        Well, all my pdf's seem to open perfectly in CorelDraw, maintaining everything...:-)....! Perhaps that is because all my pdf's were created in CorelDraw.....

        Originally posted by Bob View Post
        But you see, the workflow is intentionally set up this way to prevent users from doing what you're trying to do, because as a production practice, it's wrong. Source files are for editing, PDFs are for handing off.
        I use PDF files in order to send my CorelDraw files to clients. So the source file is a CorelDraw file. If I'm doing major editing, I just republish to pdf over/in place of the old version. In this particular case I wanted to make a single pdf of two separate pdf files (each made from its respective cdr file). It was intriguing to realize that I could do this within Corel--without a pdf editor.

        Originally posted by Bob View Post
        If you're just after page deleting/addition/order -- all that is easily done from directly within Acrobat Pro-- without any risk of page content errors.
        Obviously PDF's can be easily edited in a PDF editor...:-)....I don't have Acrobat Pro and am not interested in purchasing it--or Adobe Distiller. The idea was to see if in fact it is possible to use CorelDraw as a PDF editor...:-)...

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        • #5
          Bob is an expert Corel user. I'd take him at his word if he says it isn't a good idea.

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          • #6
            IF you are just looking to split a PDF into two PDFs I'm pretty sure you can do that in Reader. However If all of your pdfs were created in corel (I'm assuming by you) why not just use the source file to make new pdfs?
            Last edited by kemingMatters; 07-03-2012, 10:00 AM.
            Design is not decoration.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by PrintDriver View Post
              Bob is an expert Corel user. I'd take him at his word if he says it isn't a good idea.
              To be fair, I'm dwindling in that department as I have not upgraded since X5. But the main PDF module hasn't changed that much, I believe.

              The important thing to remember if you want to go with the CDR>PDF>CDR>PDF workflow is to use the PDF Export preset called 'Editing'. This preset: "creates a high-quality PDF file intended to be sent to a printer or digital copier. This style enables LZW compression, embeds fonts, and includes hyperlinks, bookmarks, and thumbnails. It displays the PDF file with all the fonts, with all of the images at full resolution, and with hyperlinks, so that you can edit the file at a later date." (from Corel Help files)

              This sounds an awful lot liek AI's 'Preserve Illustrator Editing Capabilities' PDF SaveAs option. What that does is essentially 'nail-on' the PDF to the existing source AI file. Bigger file -- but client can read it, and Ai can re-open it without losing anything (including links).

              Unfortunately, because there's no filename distinction between a PDF with full Editing Capabilities preserved, and those without any -- this practice kind of promotes the impression that AI or CorelDraw are some kind of universal PDF editors, which can be a potentially fatal and/or expensive mistake.

              As for moving/adding/deleting pages around inside Acrobat -- sure, that's editing. But it's at a page/document level which is really not the same as editing at the object level and does not actually effect the content of the PDF pages.

              The real problems begin when assuming that either AI or CDraw is some kind of benign, universal PDF editor.

              I personally would advocate that both companies include a very detailed warning pop-up when opening a PDF about any potential problems in doing so. They do this for other graphic formats (such as compression options in Photoshop) -- why not do the same for PDF opening attempts?

              FTR, here's the 'pothole' list from Corel X5's help files:

              +++++++++++++++++++++++

              Publishing a PDF file
              • Texture fills created in CorelDRAW are exported and imported as bitmap patterns.

              Importing a PDF file
              • Transparency applied to text and graphics is preserved.
              • Character attributes of text, including superscript and subscript, are preserved.
              • DeviceN color spaces may be converted to RGB or CMYK processed colors in the imported file, depending on the file content.
              • Layers are preserved in files created with Adobe Acrobat 6 and later.
              • Xform objects are converted to symbols.
              • Symbols are preserved when PDF files created with version 1.3 or later undergo round-tripping.
              • Pattern and texture fills are preserved.
              • Most mesh fills created in Adobe Illustrator are preserved.
              • Comments are preserved and imported on a separate “Comments” layer in the document.
              • Text annotations, including free text annotations, are imported as paragraph text.
              • Sticky Notes display as a rectangle with the appropriate background and border color. Headers in Sticky Notes are not supported.
              • Line annotations display as straight lines with the appropriate width and color. Arrows with different fill and outline colors display fill and outline of the same color.
              • Square and circle annotations display as rectangles and ellipses with the appropriate fill/outline properties. Polygon and polyline annotations are mapped as polycurves with similar fill/outline properties. Cloud shapes display as polygons.
              • Text markup annotations, such as highlights, underlining, and strikeouts, are imported.
              • Standard ink and stamp annotations are supported. Custom stamp annotations are not supported.
              • Sound annotations, movie annotations, and file link annotations are not supported.

              +++++++++++++++++++++++

              Note that this list is not comprehensive or very accurate. I have found other Corel-only features that can easily get messed up if you depend on a CDR>PDF>CDR workflow. Especially combinations. Note that links are not preserved in this workflow (unlike AI's 'Save with AI editing' route).

              If you don't have Acrobat Pro, I would investigate some of the other PDF document editing utilities out there. Many handle tasks like page editing very smoothly. It's because they're working on the page level editing -- not object level -- they can afford to keep these apps low-cost or even free.

              When you get to real production PDF Object level editing from with Acrobat, you're talking big ticket -- like Extensis PitStop. Great Acrobat Plugin, but very expensive. Worth it if you're in, say a print shop, though.

              And not to sound too alarmist, but multi-paged CorelDraw files are almost always a red-flag to production people. Not that AI isn't doing the same these days -- but it also perpetuates the impression that drawing apps can replace layout apps. In my experience, you have to be extra careful when assuming this. There are very good reasons why we have both drawing and layout apps. Most of them have to do with maintaining reliable production.

              Comment


              • #8
                Add, Delete, and Change the Order of Pages

                Originally posted by Bob View Post

                If you don't have Acrobat Pro, I would investigate some of the other PDF document editing utilities out there. Many handle tasks like page editing very smoothly. It's because they're working on the page level editing -- not object level -- they can afford to keep these apps low-cost or even free.
                All I need is a pdf 'editor' which can add, delete, and change the order of pages, as I do all my object level editing in the original cdr file (and then republish). I use PDF XChange viewer because of its excellent viewing and annotation abilities, but the free viewer does not add, delete, or change the order of pages. Any recommendations for a free doc editor which need do nothing more than these three things...?

                Thanks!

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                • #9
                  Check out some of these: http://tinyurl.com/793xaa7

                  There's also online PDF editors (like PDF Hammer) that allow you to shuffle pages and more. But you have to be okay with uploading the PDF.
                  Last edited by Bob; 07-10-2012, 07:56 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    PDF-Shuffler

                    Originally posted by Bob View Post
                    Check out some of these: http://tinyurl.com/793xaa7
                    PDF-Shuffler (Sourceforge) seems just right, but how do you handle a .tar.gz file? I kept on extracting with 7-zip, but all the final files have generic (white paper with turned down corner) icons and ask which program opens them.....


                    Janet

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