New student Graphic designer from Holland

Somehow I missed this thread and didn’t get in on the action. :Dang it! :wink:

No time to read long, informative, and helpful posts. No time or respect for education. No time to pay attention to others’ expert advice, Sign me up to learn the software and I’ll be good to go, and don’t tell me otherwise or I’ll throw passive-aggressive insults your way.

I wish this person the best of luck, but I suspect my wish won’t make up for the writing that’s already plainly written on the wall. Of course, this person will have no time or patience to read that writing.

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(TheOffice)That’s what she said.(/TheOffice)

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Why? You wouldn’t say that if anyone suggested that a chiropodist, lawyer, radiologist, plumber, electrician, etc should be qualified in order to practice – ah no, hang on, they do! Why should design be different?

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I’m reminded of some old Supertramp lyrics.

But then they sent me away to teach me how to be sensible
Logical, oh, responsible, practical
Then they showed me a world where I could be so dependable
Oh, clinical, oh, intellectual, cynical

I said, now, watch what you say, they’ll be calling you a radical
A liberal, oh, fanatical, criminal
Oh, won’t you sign up your name? We’d like to feel you’re acceptable
Respectable, oh, presentable, a vegetable

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A vegetable. That’s me!

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Has anyone ever died due to incompetent graphic design? perhaps a poorly designed traffic sign?

Anyway, as I mentioned, I think the exam would be laughably easy because of the subjectivity involved and any standard would necessarily be… very very standard.

If you’re serious about this, how do you imagine qualifying for licensing? A degree shouldn’t be enough because a crappy designer can get a degree.

It isn’t going to happen anyway. However, a lack of any sort of regulation whatsoever, allows for the YouTube educated to charge money for work, that simply won’t, … well … work. Sure, no one will die, but if you take money off people for a service, surely there has to be some responsibility taken on the part of a designer to offer a service of actual value.

No one would likely die from the actions, or inactions of a rogue insurance broker, but there are rules in place to regulate and ensure that the person providing the service, is providing a service that is accountable and responsible.

To imply that any sort of regulation would be risibly meaningless, is surely indicative of how much credible regulation is needed.

Anyway, we could go round in circles on this, but the bottom line, is that currently, the industry is flooded by unqualified self-proclaimed designers as to be causing some serious issues. At least the requirement of an accredited degree would be something.

I recently worked with a self-proclaimed designer/developer who had been taking money of a client for years and what she had been delivering was atrocious. She had no idea what she didn’t know and was ignorantly preying on the ignorance of a client who trusted that her money was being spent effectively. It wasn’t. Surely there should be some protection and surety for clients.

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I can see how the OP is rubbing his hands in glee now.

He is probably just still young … I hope.

Didn’t last a day. The reason made me smile :grin:

So a degree then?

I’m pretty sure that anyone spending serious money is looking for such a qualification regardless of licensing, and in this case, a designer wouldn’t get a job or client without a strong portfolio.

Who cares if bad business people spend a few hundred or thousand on crappy design? I don’t.

I think you may have just proved my point.

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I would like to read these texts

Unless you can explain I suggest that you rethink this.

Mrs. B returned to school to get her master’s in social work. Working as a professional requires an MSW, over a thousand hours of internship, and passing a day-long exam. The questions in one part of the exam were entirely subjective.

For example:

You’re working at a homeless shelter. A resident approaches who you know was diagnosed with schizophrenia and symptoms of dementia consistent with longterm alcohol addiction. In confidence, he tells you that he overheard another resident mention begging for money near elementary schools because the children are sometimes very friendly. Which of the following is the most appropriate course of action?


There are no definitively wrong or right answers. Instead, the answers consist of plausible responses that are primarily subjective and depend on a dozen variables that might be viewed differently by different social workers. This exam phase contains several hundred of these types of questions.

The possible answers to all these questions were previously vetted by dozens of licensed and experienced social workers who rated each answer for each question from one to five.

The cumulative responses of these experienced and licensed social workers determine how each answer is weighted and scored. For example, let’s say that 58 percent of licensed social workers responded that answer B was most appropriate, but 34 percent rated E as the best answer. Examination scores would reflect B as the best answer with, for example, 10 points awarded, whereas answering E would only garner 4 points.

An algorithm determines the cumulative score of each exam by weighing all the scores against the percentages of how the licensed social workers weighted those same answers. The result is a final score comparing the frequency of the examinee’s subjective answers to those of the experienced and licensed social workers.

I’m not suggesting that something exactly like this would work for a graphic design licensing exam, but I am suggesting that accurately measuring and scoring subjective judgments is entirely possible.

my certification for GD does not require any exam. Nor a portfolio review by adjudicators “in the field.”
A bachelors degree plus a specified number of hours (TBD) working as a journeyman designer.
That’s it.
The trick is getting that journeymanship. There are too many design students and part of the exam is being good enough to land that.

Yeah, I think something along those lines could work. At least it would be better than the out-of-control death spiral the profession seems to be in at the moment.

Anyone with the talent, drive, temperament and necessary tenacity could navigate the hurdles. Formal education would still be the best way to get there, but the method you suggested of weeding out the less-dedicated would still enable alternate routes into the licensed profession.

In the 2000 U.S. presidential election, the race came down to a few hundred votes in Florida’s Palm Beach County. The design of the ballot was confusing, and for many people, it appeared the space next to third-party candidate Pat Buchanan was the spot to punch if one meant to vote for Al Gore.

A subsequent study determined that around 2,000 people mistakenly voted for Pat Buchanan rather than Al Gore. In that extremely close election, those miscast votes were enough to give George W. Bush the win in Florida, which gave Bush enough Electoral College votes to win the national election, despite his popular vote loss.

Incompetent ballot graphic design was literally a determining factor in the U.S. 2000 presidential election.

9-11 would likely still have occurred in a Gore administration, and it probably would have resulted in the invasion of Afghanistan. However, Gore would never have launched the subsequent invasion of Iraq, which killed around 200,000 Iraqis and led to the formation of ISIS, which killed thousands more.

My point isn’t to blame George W. Bush. However, it’s reasonable to assume that the death of a quarter million people would not have happened if not for the awful design of those Palm Beach County ballots.

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Objectively judging subjective judgments? Surely you can see the error here.

There’s little point in mentioning social work anyway, simply suggest GD exam questions and we’ll see how it goes.

No, I think it works reasonably well in the absence of black-and-white answers, and I explained how. Other fields and endeavors that also depend on subjective evaluations and judgments based on group input also have methods of arriving at a consensus.

Your method of conversation seems to involve making dismissive statements of disagreement without explaining whatever logic you used to arrive at your opinions.

ooh, yeah. Just what i want. More and more ‘followers’ that ‘give advice’ on Twitwit and FacePlant.
And whatever PacDora is, I bet you are selling it.
Good bye.